Can someone help me out here? I just purchased this piece for my collection. It is Canadian and what I would like to know is if the dome is a different color black than the black on the two collars of the tower? I have a 1998-199 Greenbook and the color for the dome seems the same as the collars but, on the one I just purchased, the dome is a different color black and also duller. If someone has any knowlede of this I would appreciate a response? I just have this feeling that this piece has been touched up. I really don't know.

Walt

While I suspect that my West Quoddy piece is not Canadian(#1167)because there is no evidence of ever having a Made in Canada sticker on the felt, it does have a lightning rod. The two bands are black(dull) and the dome is brown(dull). The lightning ball itself is black(a little shiney). I bought the piece used so I assume this is the color of the early Malaysians pieces. My felt is a lighter green then todays green felt and it does not come all the way to the edge of the base. There is about an 1/8" gap to the edge. Maybe someone can shed some light on whether my piece is Canadian or as I assume an early Malaysian.

Mine is made in Malaysia #3423.
The rings of the cat walk are black.
The dome is a dark brown with no rod.

I have a #76 with a shiney medium redish brown top with dull black collars. The felt on the bottom is a grey & white mix.

As for the felt question, the original heavy green felt used on Canadian pieces was replaced with a lighter weight green felt that did not come all the way to the edge. The later felt was replaced with a heavier felt that came all the way to the edges to help avoid nicks and chips that happened with the felt that did not come all the way to the edge.

Walt
I have a 423 Canadian and a 2373 Malaysian w/ rod
Both have black rings and a dark brown dome.
The 423 has shades of brown mixed in on the dome.
The 2373 has dark solid brown dome.

JUST GOT A Canadian made with the number 512. Nothing unusual with it except that it made me look better at my #423. I received my West Quoddy #512 with sticker and white box so that I could replace my other one that has no box or Canadian Sticker. I was getting ready to sell my #423 on the forum when I started to compare it with my higher numbered Canadian. It has the same paint style and felt, but there is one major difference. It is made from an California mold. It has the deep windows that look like someone poked them with a pencil. It also has the 6 panes in the window in the second floor instead of the eight. Needless to say that I am excited and am no planning to sell it. One of the interesting things of this find is that the California Mold could still be found on a higher number like #423. I usually quit looking for one by #300.

Daniel -- it's possible that the piece you refer to was made in Canada.

This era turns out to be among the most interesting in Harbour Lights history IMO. And for those who like to collect variations, it's a 'gold mine'.

According to Kim in a discussion at the 1997 Collectors Reunion, when Harbour Lights shifted production to Castle Studios in Ontario, Canada the original molds were shipped to the Studios along with a supply of the grey felt used on the bottoms.

Sometime during production in Canada, Castle Studios offered to 'clean up' the molds, improving the doors and windows and adding a 'collar' below the ventilator ball on the tops of towers. This strengthened the ventilator, making it less likely to break off. They also replaced the hand-shaped ventilator ball with a ball bearing, making the ventilator a perfectly round shape.

Thus the 'Canadian changes' didn't necessarily happen immediately after production began in Canada.

According to Kim, the original Southern California production was supposed to have been 250 of each of the 'Original 17'. However all 266 of the Original Cape Hatteras were made in Southern California.

You can read more about these changes in an archived area of the Harbour Lights web site at:

www.harbourlights.com/archive/modifications/
(Sorry, some of the images are missing from this page.)

Also check out this page on the shift of production to Canada:
www.harbourlights.com/archive/modifications/pages/canada.htm

Keep in mind that pieces were/are not necessarily numbered in the order in which they were/are cast. They are cast, placed on racks, pulled off racks, cleaned up (mold marks), perhaps replaced on racks, painted (not by one person all at one time), bottom material added (probably after painting), inspected, and hand numbered.

It depends on how many were ordered produced at one time. In the early days, orders may have been placed in quantities of 250. Today, some pieces with small production runs are ALL produced at one time.

I doubt that the typical FIFO (First In, First Out) method was used at each step. So it's probable that the order of production is very different from the order of casting within a production run.

This means that your #423 does NOT mean that all the pieces from #251 (assumed to be the first number assigned to a Canadian produced Quoddy) to #500 (if 250 were ordered) would all have the same modifications and same bottom material.

Remember that a typical Canadian piece have a 'flocked' bottom in which glue was spread on the bottom (back from the edge a bit) and the flocking was applied (dipped?) to the bottom.

CF members and guests can also read more about these terms and see examples of pictures of some of the modifications at: www.harbourlights.com/glossary.htm

Paul Brady has a West Quoddy that has a very different paint job -- the window sills and other areas have a pink paint job. I believe there has been one other such paint job reported on these Forums.

John
I totally agree that my #423 is a Canadian made. It has the typical recessed green-flocked bottom. All the paint colors match my other Canadians. It even has the collar and the larger vent ball. It is the body only that matches the California made. You are probably right, all of the West quoddys with a number below do not necessarily have California mold, but it would be interesting to find out. I love collecting the low numbered early Harbour Lights there is always a surprise. That’s why I have two or three or more of most of the first 40 and growing.


Now when it comes to the CH-1, Kim also told me that they are all made in California. Maybe they were all made in California but from my research I have found the green tip CH-1 have the green felt (not the Gray) and came in a brown Castle studios Box. I have found this information from talking to several of the owners of the Green tip CH-1.
From the Rutherford books I remember Jim saying that when the manufacturing switched from California that all phases of the lighthouses were sent to Canada. This was the felt, molds, boxes, and the unpainted figurines. Maybe the first 266 figurines were made in Calififornia but to me it looks like the last 100 or less where painted, felt attached and boxed in Canada.

You are right -- I also remember Kim saying they shipped unpainted items to Canada to be finished.

Harbour Lights had/has a tendency to over order runs by a few pieces. If a purchaser ended up with a broken piece, HL could replace the piece with another, matching the original buyer's number. So that might account for more than 250 of CH1. With lots of broken ones in shipment, they could have used up the 'extras' and reported that they shipped 260.

Keep in mind that many of these were broken in shipment so the number of unbroken ones that reached collectors could easily be under 100.

This is also true of Point Arena. The reported production is the number shipped, without accounting for large quantities that were broken in shipment to dealers and were returned to HL for credit or replacement by the dealers.

I mentioned to Kim once that my 'guess' on the number of unbroken Point Arenas that reached collectors was about 2,000. She responded "you think there were THAT many?" -- like my guess was way to high.