The Greenbook and Checkerbee Publishing's guides are 2 years out of date. The Survival Guide is defunct.

So if YOU were designing a new guide for collectors of Harbour Lights, what would you want to see in it? How would it be organized? How much would you be willing to pay for your 'dream guide'?

I`d like to see a mini-chart,covering all years since production,in the form seen in other threads.The chart giving info on high-low prices(avg.from secondary,ebay,marketplace).Variations,with photos,on each piece.Must haves include color photos,retail prices,edition sizes,brief history.Number of pieces actually produced of the edition size.I like the grouping in thr Green Book,with LEs,Special Lights(ones that didn`t make it to production),Christmas,Society,GLOW,Ornaments.Then two indexes,one alphabetical,one numerical(piece#).

terry

I would like to see a setup like the survival guide with all the up to date info and with setup that would allow updates for prices ed ammounts etc,Some sort of an Email letter could be sold to update.

don

I too like the set up of the survival guide.
I think the variation information is important, as well as the relative prices on the secondary market, both for a guide in purchasing, and a basis for insurance needs. I also liked the lighthouse capsules that Jim did in his guide.
I think a price point of $20.00 or so is about right. And perhaps an e-version, at least the parts that are not on the HL website already.
Jim
Johnson

I agree that the format of the Survival Guide is a good one.

Add to it the threads from the Forums that have closely followed the price variations and stir in a update either by email or website and I think it covers all bases. I'm sure there will be something I missed.

The cost of $15-20 for the hardcopy version with an additional $5-10 if you want regular updates or access to a website.

Dennis

>>How much would you be willing to pay for your 'dream guide'?<<

Well, if she could cook... oh lighthouses, ahem, yes. How 'bout a CD with data you could download to your GPS that would lead you to every lighthouse on the planet.

If HL wanted to be real smurfy, they could include a color factoid sheet with every model that would fit easily into a small 3 ring-binder. Complete with space for a passport stamp from visiting the real light and space to fill in info such as retirement date, final edition size, etc.

Reviews, reunion coverage, prescient commentary, Paul Brady photos, manufacturing history. It should be free and it should be on the Web. I think we're almost there! :-)

__
/im
[This message has been edited by JTimothyA (edited 02-06-2001).]

Also, include a personnal HL inventory itemization section similar to what St John posted several months ago.
- Joe

[This message has been edited by easya (edited 02-04-2001).]

Well let's see......edition sizes and variations, manufacturing and or creation process information, a bit of history on each light, pictures, a user guide inventory sheet of their own collection, care and collection tips, maybe an access code to a link that would have secondary current prices.....rather than printing it. History of company and the lights. The guide I have from the Rutherfords is pretty full of information. I would pay $25-$50.00. I figured I have thousdands invested, I should want to pay a reasonable amount for the right guide. Sure hope one gets completed.

Good Luck!

What is really needed is a book like the Green bookor the collectors value guide and the survival guide with the quarterly updates.if this could be put together in one book/w update letters fine to a serious collector this would be invaluable.
Bill O'Brien oseabee

I would also like to see something organized similar to the survival guide with listings of all variations. I think the guide could sell for around $20-$25 with an optional $5-$10 for internet access & email updates.

I would like a guide book that you could add on to. If the format was in a 3-ring binder, people could buy the initial guide book and then have the option to buy annual updates for each new year. This could be more cost effecient than to continually buy new guide books that cover the same information that was previously printed on the early HL's.

I would enjoy having a single page dedicated to each HL. It would be nice to have the photo of the sculpture large enough to see some of the details. I would also like the page to have a pocket where you could store the C of A. I have never found a good place to store those.

Lorie,

I like your idea of a dynamic and expanding Guide. You could have revisions if mistakes or changes occurred. you'd just reprunt the appropriate pages.

New material could be added on a regular basis- monthly or quarterly updates. you could even set it up to be done on the web or email and just print it out yourself.

Dennis

Here's an update on Greenbook I just received from them by mail

"The company that was publishing the Greenbooks is no longer in business. The
two Dept 56 books are being taken over by us, the Village Chronicle.
Unfortunately we are unable to continue the software program because we do
not have the ability to provide technical support.

Greenbooks for other collectibles will not be published any longer.

If I can be of any further assistance, please email me or call at
401-467-9343.

Happy Collecting,

Jeanne
the Village Chronicle"

It would seem to behoove HL collectors to continue in our search for creating a new guide!
GEM

I have never seen the Greenbook or the Survivor's Guide so I can't compare to either of them. I would like to see a picture of each release, maybe if there is a GLOW, I'd like to see a side-by-side comparison of LE to GLOW to ornament. I would also like to see a paragraph or two about the light itself and why HL's chose that particular light.

Joanne

I'd like to see a big autographed color photo of author John Chidester inside the front cover.

And if everyones expectations could be met that were mentioned previously, I'd pay $20 - $30 for it.

Rich

------------------

Obviously you have a good start here with all the information you guys have been loging for all these years.
I - History of the Company, Reunions and releases.
II - A living compilation(as previosly suggested - subscription and updates quaterly - like law books - relacement and new pages) of all HLs with their own page for each one which should include all the basics of the piece, history of the LH, Mr Brady's photo journal, St John's incites.
III - Art's Secondary Values and Charts
IV - Ric Mau's Retired @ Retail
V - Tim's Factiods and Other Philosophies
VI - Bill H.'s Reviews
VII - Forum History
VIII - Collector Bios and LH Photos
IX - HL Clubs
X - Lighthouse Societies
XI - LH Websites

It's all here and on HL Site, it just has to organized so that more than 600 of us access it. How many Society members are there? 40,000?



[This message has been edited by rscroope (edited 02-05-2001).]

I have really enjoyed Jim Rutherford's "Survival Guide". I have read it many times and refer to it often. Quite frankly, it would be hard to improve on. If someone is taking on the task, I would also recommend some of Bill Harnsberger's reviews. That's great writing!
- Joe

I have to agree with Lorie Roe on a 3 ring standard binder where it could be updated each year or whenever needed. Old pages could be taken out and new ones inserted and the book could be kept up to date at a lower cost in buying a new complete book each year. Hal

I don't know the legal status of the Survival
Guide or the various claims that people are working out with Jim and Julie, but it's evident here that many people liked the format of that publication. Perhaps Jim could donate the name and format to a group or individual so that the publication could continue as the foremost guide for collectors.
Jim
Johnson

I have all three guides. Very rarely use the Survival Guide, guess I don't like the like the lack of photos. Also found it didn't address variations especially later production differences. For example, no note of differences in Cape Meares which has been discussed & shown here on the forums.

Like the Collector's guide pages to enter the individual HL purchases, price, edition # etc. Keeps my running total up to date.

Certainly a range of secondary market prices especially as affected by E-bay.

Like too, the binder concept with updates easy to add.

Cost is relative, many of us have major dollars invested in our collections and a comprehensive, current guide is a necessity to us! Newbies need a guide just to sort through the years, variations,values, Glows etc. So much of what is common knowledge to long-time collectors must seem confusing to newer collectors.

I was thrilled when I first bought my Collector's Guide several years ago as a new collector. It answered so many questions!

Donna

I thought the Survival Guide was an excellant tool for HL collectors. Something simple for us "simple Minded collectors" would be good !!!

Taking my earlier message a bit further...

Please imagine the Guide on the Internet. Your own personalized 'survival guide' available through an Internet login. Everyone's guide has the same pictures, history, etc., but each person's could be different - it would be personalized as their own. We'll call it

The Web Keeper's Catalogue^TM

Here's a feature list:

Complete
Full color photos - gotta have 'em. Along with all the information you could publish in a book. Stats, prices, spreadsheets, variations, history, reviews - you name it.

Organized
You can sort and organize the information the way you want it. By year, geographic region, purchase date, your want list - however you'd like it organized. Computers sort data quickly and don't care if you re-order as you please.

Personalized
Each individual collector/user gets to input their own data. Dates of purchase, price paid, dealer - whatever we can think of worth storing - along with a note pad for your own thoughts. Each lighthouse model gets a page for you to enter you personal information. And you can change it - update it whenever you want. It would even allow you to include your own photos in your own catalogue.

Keep track of your purchases and compare your want lists with secondary prices. Your info is permanently stored on the Web, so you don't have to worry about losing your collector's log-book. Naturally its downloadable to your own computer if you wish.

Share with Family & Friends
Of course your information is only available for you to see and update. But - and this is cool - you can have "Keeper Buddies^TM" - if you want to let someone else leaf through your catalogue (read only of course) you can share it with them over the Web by keeping a list of people who can logon to your own edition. Even share photos so others could put your pics in their catalogue. Or - imagine an icon on your forum messages that hot-links to your own personal catalogue.

Printable for a 3-ring Binder
Pages of model data along with your own information get - at your request - packaged into a PDF file (Adobe Acrobat) or an RTF file (Microsoft & word processors) and can be downloaded and printed, whenever you want. The format of the page can be designed for inclusion in a binder. Even color photos can be printed if you have a color ink-jet or laser.

Accessible
Its available from anywhere. Not only can you print and take with, you can access your own personal catalogue from anywhere the Internet is available. Your laptop, your sister's house, your dealers PC, your Palm Pilot, etc.

Up to Date
Updates are made available to everyone simultaneously. Secondary prices as frequent as whomever gathers prices can gather. See news and reviews when published - not just once a year.

Exciting
And then there's multi-media. Imagine opening your Keeper's Catalogue and getting a personal video message from Bill Younger about the history of the model or a digital tour of the model being made.

These are just a few ideas. Imagine if the Rutherford survival guide had been available on the Web. (I tried convincing Jim to do this.) I know some of Jim's hassles in creating the original guides were the costs and effort to deal with printing houses, getting copy prepared, taking subscriptions, mailing, etc. By the time you got it, it was partially out of date. The cost of print publishing full color photographs in limited edition is *very* expensive. Publishing on the Web can solve many of these issues while also providing you with a printable version.

Sounds pretty neat to me - the best of many worlds. A 'living book' designed by and for the people who will use it. Dream Guide? Science filction? No way - this is all *very* do-able. Whattya think?

From the House of Fogsignal,
__
/im


[This message has been edited by JTimothyA (edited 02-07-2001).]

This sounds GREAT Tim. Quite a project though?
I think John was looking for a challenge.
The only problem would be the great number of collectors who do not use a computer. Yes, in this day and age, it's hard to believe but I meet lighthouse people all the time who don't. (more than 50%)The participation here as compared to the Collectors Society - 600/40,000 shows that.
I'm sure everybody here would love it - always up-to-date, and fresh with news!

Tim sound like you have some great ideas and the more I have been reading about the loose leaf Idea the better I like it.
Bill O'Brien oseabee

There have been some great suggestions! The idea of a HOHL (History of Harbour Lights), photos and narratives of each HL along with estimated worth, photos from the first three reunions (includes Baltimore 2001), photos of some of the top collectors with bios, accomplishments thanks to the efforts of the Younger Family, etc. would make a great book for the wackos of the HL Family of Friends.

I would also like to see a special section on the efforts of John Chidester to promote HL collecting across the country and maybe even around the world. John was a major influence in my decision to "get them all".

I would also like to see another special section on Paul Brady and his talents as a photographer recording all the great images used by Harbour Lights.

I would also like to see another special section dedicated to Mark Sherman and the wonderful prints he has done for Harbour Lights.

Did I leave anything out that hasn't already been mentioned?

Bob

Don't underestimate the Internet, Bob. 70% of American households have computers. There may be some people who don't have computers but I'm willing to bet the majority of HL collectors do. While lighthouses themselves are historical and tend to stay where they're put, collecting HL models is not a passive hobby. There's tons of lighthouse books, but a guide is not about lighthouses, its about the models and the hobby. Keeping information fresh and interesting is a key part of a thriving hobby!

Great ideas everyone I like the three ring binder idea that way we could always slip in extra information pages if we wanted like things we learn from the posts or possibly get a few blank pages with the book titled post tips then we could write down all these interesting tidbits we learn off the posts then that day when we actually need the info we won't we scrambling through the forum trying to find the information..........LOL
Also the pocket sounds good too that way we could store our paperwork in there and maybe receipts for insurance purposes and maybe a picture of the light we have taken on a visit
and yes there be a lots of pictures of each Harbour light peice and maybe some interesting tidbits on how they decided to do that paticular light or a funny story about something that happened in the making or something!
Please add my ideas to the list of all the others when you start the book! Oh and I love the idea of the web site but I would have to have a book to carry about and write in and such! I would be more than willing to give 50$ for such a book as long as it would be updateable and an extra 10 for the web accesss. The autographed picture would be great and im sure it would raise the value.