My question is simply "What can we do to improve participation by both established members and new members just joining the Forums"?

I've been thinking about this problem for quite some time. We average between 300-400 visitors(members and non-members) during any 12 hour period each day. Of these 300-400 visitors, approximately 40-50 are registered Forum members. Of the registered Forum members, only 7-8 post on a regular basis. We have been averaging 1-2 new members each week, but, none of the newer members post either on a regular or non-regular basis. We are declining further and further on our posts and either we step up to the plate and improve this or we will slowly fade into the sunset.

Here are some of the reasons I have heard for not posting by our regular members:
1. I don't have the time anymore.
2. I have nothing interesting to say.
3. I feel dumb posting when everyone else know the answers.
4. I have lost interests in lighthouses but still like to read the posts.
5. I don't collect so why post.
6. There are no new posts so how can I respond.

Do these reasons for not posting fit your reasons for not participating? Now what can we do to spike your interests again? Here are some suggestions:
1. Do away with some of the older, less interesting and out of date forums and replace them with more current forums.
2. Add new lighthousing forums that deal with lighthouses in general and not pertaining directly to Harbour Lights.
3. Add a new forums strickly for new members(or older members) to ask questions about Harbour Lights and lighthouses in general.
4. Add forums where collectibles other then Harbour Lights can be discussed.
5. Add a forum where other collectibles can be bought/sold/traded.

I'm asking for input from all registered members and not just the reliable 7-8 that post on a regular basis. No ideas will be disregarded or laughed at and some MAY be implemented. Any and all ideas are welcome whether they are from established or new members. We have got to do something to jump start our Forums or we will continue to decline until the Forums is not worth visiting.

I found this forum because of Harbour Lights, but I joined and participate because of the lighthouse information. I think adding more lighthouse forums is a great idea.

Come up with an interesting Topic, and put it in General Forum and it may evolve into a new Forum. I put up some new topics and pulled up old topics to try to get some excitement. Some work, some dont. Give it a try. No one needs to get a Forum approval to try.

One idea that might help, and this has to be kept in mind by posters somehow, is to give some type of appropiate comment or follow up (if it's that type of post) to the post at hand. Many times a person takes the time to post and it is ignored or passed over like it never happened--so the poster may assume "why did I take the time--no one gives a heck". This can discourage posting, especially by those who don't post often. OR, the next post after someone posts is about something that doesn't even relate to the previous post and may just relate to something regular posters care to talk about--again ignoring the previous post.

The visitor numbers and number of new forum members joining regularly seem like a tremendous resource to tap into somehow, both for growing HL and lighthouses in general. Maybe someone(s) could take the time to ask new members personally as part of the welcoming process or a new members survey or whatever, what they would be interested in discussing. Followup of new members might also be helpful to get their ideas and feelings after they've been a forum member for awhile. These ideas may reveal or give a clue to new forums to be added or old forums to be dropped.

Laura - What are some of the new Forums that you would like to see added?

Bob - Please feel free to bring up new subjects in the General Forum or any forum that you see fit. Also, you have been around long enough to know what subjects have been the most interesting in the past. Rejuvinate them by bringing them up again.

Max - You have a very good idea on a survey going to new members. I would be happy to send a survey out to the last 30-40 new members to get their input on what they feel. Could you send me an email with what you feel should be included in this survey and the format that you think it should be in. You and I can work this offline a lot easier, and if there is anyone else out there that has some things they feel should be in the survey, feel free to send them to me to look at.

Make it easier to post photos. (Even you have a problem Rich). I'm sure that we could get more members doing it if they could just have a simpler way of doing it! Used to be able to post photos from a website before the upgrade, can't even do that anymore except for the avatar.

Rich, I have been doing that for some time.
Mystery LH
Top 5 LH Seen, to Visit?
and so forth

Downloading photos is not all that hard. The key is reducing the size of the digital to '400 x 600' or '600 x 400'.Much smaller than the digital picture you take!
Posting only becomes a problem if you have spaces in the filename.
Maybe Paul can update his procedure to make it even more simpler?
I think the current method is the easiest that can be done with the current 'proprietory software' release.

Bottom line. Do your best and Dave, Paul, Myself or someone else will help you correct it. Once you have a successful file you can copy and paste - just replacing the new file name.

Speaking as someone who has been given help several times...it is hard. And it can be embarrassing to ask for help, I just decided to ask anyway. I was a Wacko for a year before I finally (with help) got an avatar, then quickly put one in for my sister,(btw - hers is a quilted lighthouse wall hanging she designed and made) before I forgot how. I don't know if you can make it easier, but that would be great.
Rich, I will come up with some ideas for lighthouse forums.

Even I need someone to troubleshoot once in awhile. I just email Dave with a HELP. He gets back with the solution quickly. I've had 5 good pics showing and 1 problem. It's usually something that you looked at over and over. An outside person can give it a fresh look, and help you out. If I can ask for help after all my years on the Forum - anyone can.

Try it - you'll like it!
Let me know if I can help.

Bob

Laura - Thanks and I'll be waiting for your suggestions.

I have not received any separate correspondance concerning ideas on improving the Forums and only a few ideas, but, no real examples posted in this topic. Maybe the Forums is broke and we should leave well enough alone. Out of the 51 members that have recently voted about the LHD Clearance sale, only 5 members has chosen to post on this topic. This is really disappointing that the majority of the 51 members haven't taken the time to even post a short response saying they are satisfied with things the way they are now.

Don't give up Rich, there's a lot of Lighthouse people here. I send emails to my siblings, kids, friends etc. with unique photos of them and rarely get a response. Very frustrating!

I think part of it is that it seems like forums, in general, are a bit of a dying breed. I've noticed these very same issues on other boards I belong to. With the advent of new social websites such as Facebook, there are other ways to communicate.

Example: I'm friends with about 20-25 people from the CF on Facebook. Conversations which used to happen here now happen on Facebook. And it also draws in lighthouse people who weren't CF members (or interested in being such), and friends from other parts of my life who can relate to non-lighthouse discussions.

Not that I don't still appreciate what the CF can offer, but there are a lot of discussions that I used to have here that now occur on Facebook.

In the past 24 hours, we've had 400 visitors to the Collector Forums.

I concur with Greg - we can't compete with Facebook. BF (Before Facebook), we had a very social role among our friends with greetings and family updates. That role has been taken over by FB; ain't nothing we can do to improve on FB.

Now we serve a more technical role - trading, questioning, complaining, voting and 'news' about Harbour Lights and, to a limited extent, about lighthouses.

Should someone develop a "Lighthouseville" game on Facebook, we'll probably be dead in the water (or next to the water.) [Just kidding!]

Participation is just a part of why we're here. The fact that 400 people took the time to visit us in the last 24 hours shows they are still interested and we serve to keep them up-to-date and stoke the fires of their interest.

We've been around since 1997. Going on 13 years now. hundreds have joined, participated and moved on. "Silent supporters" find us, read for a while and a few join in the participation. Old members and newbies drop off.

It can be overwhelming to a newbie to see people with thousands of posts wondering if they can contribute or participate. Maybe we should hide the number of posts and when we registered?

We tried giveaways to increase the participating; didn't really work. We've had exclusives -- which helped to raise funds, but I doubt that it brought in new members.

The on-going poll about LHD discounting retired society pieces shows one-third of the 51 voters are no longer collecting. (And I suspect that if all CF active participants were polled on this question alone, it would be 66%+.)

Let's let the Collector Forums be what it has become.

Times change. Harbour Lights has changed. We've changed as individuals.

The likelihood of another "Collectors Reunion" are slim and none. Same for regional events. We have the memories. Talk about those.

Enjoy what we have here now. We don't need to beat ourselves that it's not what it once was. Nothing ever is.

[My 12,393rd post.]

I agree with John!

Insightful summary John of where we're at now. The most encouraging statistic is those 400 people who visited in the last 24 hours and that some would like to tap into this amazing resource in these tough and changing times for CF and HL.

I agree with John. Lets leave the CF as it is and see what the future holds. Sure we could tweek the number of forums, change a few things, but I'd just leave it alone.

As for the Facebook craze. Don't like it too much. Too much useless chatter to find anything worth reading about lighthousing. Or anything for that matter!

I'll stick with the CF when I want to talk anything lighthouse related.

I am kind of with John too. I like it as it is ... and I will post if I have anything to contribute.

But then I don't like the idea of posting just for the sake of it. That would get like the mindless chatter on Facebook (which I participate in there and don't need here!)

I come and look ever so often and see what is new and who is around and what is written. And I will take part in anything I am interested in and have something to say about.

I hope to meet everyone on CF for a long time to come and I am happy to meet some of you on Facebook too. Both is valuable to me!

John, I agree.

Leave the Fourms just the way they are.

Would love to share my lighthouse adventures with other forum members. Have been to some locations I think few have, except you Bob, who has been to Alaska and Ireland like me. I have tried on more than one occasion to post photos of trips I have been on. Every time I have become so frustrated that I have given up. Now I must tell you I am not computer illiterate and use a photo program, also have done projects on shutterfly, but this site for posting photos just not user friendly!
HCS

If someone will take the time to investigate more modern methods of uploading photos by groups, email the best ones you find to me and I'll look into them and see if we can modernize them.

Please don't send me a link that says "Make it work like Facebook". Find the software that can be purchased or used for free on the Internet.

The problem is you are still going to have to know 1. the NAME of your image(s) exactly and 2. the URL of where they are stored. Capitalization DOES matter.

If you use a service like Flickr, Picassa or SmugMug, they won't let you display individual pictures within a site such as this. They will let you LINK to their sites.

Yes, Facebook has changed the way we as a society (and a business) do things. We even have recently (just this weekend) added a page for our website onto Facebook. A "discussion" section has been added so that our customers can interact within the page, just as this forum does. I'm hoping that it can not only be a place for discussions about the website, but also discussions about lighthouses. As it's very very early in the game and there has been really no promotion of it as of yet, I'm not sure how it will be received. But if we can do that, I'm sure that there are a lot of other businesses adding their own "discussion" areas. That may be where some of the past members now reside.

I don't really care how many posts there are or how many of the members make a post. To me it's the quality of the post that gets my attention. I no longer actively collect HL, although I still have my 200+ piece collection. My primary interest is the lights themselves and travelling to see lighthouses.

The last thing I want in the forums is a bunch of "fluff" and trumped up topics just to inflate the numbers of posts. Give me good quality posts about lighthouses and lighthousing and I'll keep coming back to the forums as I have been for the last 12 years or so - even if there are not very many posts.

Larry

I do not collect so I do not even look at those forums.

I am interested in lighthouses in general and showing other people that are interested in lighthouses the ones that I have found and photographed and discussing.

It is discouraging though when no one appears to be interested in what I post - maybe doesn't even look to see what it is. I don't think it is my photography skills because the Lighthouse Directory has used several of my photos including one of a lighthouse near Marigot in St. Maartin.

I am on other websites - one of them is a travel website and I put my photos either on Facebook or on the travel site, and then insert those pictures here. So putting up photos is no problem for me. I agree that the way you do it here is difficult. Maybe the directions should be stickied up at the top.

You must remember that most people just observe what's going on and fail to post. This is reflected in the amount of visitors we have each day as compared to the people that actually post. The most important thing is that you care enough to take the time to post no matter how many people reply. Keep up the good work and don't ever feel your contributions are not appreciated by those who visit this forum.

Bob

I always look Rosalie! Your trips are awesome.

I also enjoy your postings. I'm not one just to put out an idol post, but I do enjoy your postings.

I always look at your posts Rosalie. I really enjoy the your pictures. Sorry if I sometimes forget to post a reply!

OK - thanks. I will keep on posting.

I looked at some of the games, but I found it confusing if you don't get in at the beginning.

Rosalie, If you got one of the 'Digital' lighthouses right, and then posted one of your photos, we would all have such a hard time getting it! We would have no idea where in the world to start looking. Go ahead!

That assumes that I could get one right!!!

I have a few ideas for new areas or forums. They are basically things I would like and haven’t found anywhere else. Could you have a look and say whether you would contribute and if you would use them? It would be especially nice to hear from newbies.

Reporting current events at lighthouses - For example: a few weeks ago there was a lighthouse event at Calvert County Maritime Museum that I would have loved to go to, but I didn't know until the day of the event and only then because of Roland’s news letter. Maybe we could get volunteers to check websites for a certain area and report. No one can check all the websites all the time, but we can all check several and/or get on their mailing lists. Where there are regional organizations that makes it simpler. It would need some organization, investigation and recruitment. It would be a single place to check for lighthouse events by area, rather than trying to keep an eye on dozens of websites.

Reports on renovations underway - Like Moby Dick's post about Mukilteo or mine last year that the light was out at Heceta. I want to know if Assateague has been repainted. Has any member been there since Paul was there last year? I want to hear more about Round Island being rebuilt. With all the people on the forum visiting lighthouses, there could be more news and pictures of renovations.

Lighthouse information on the web – Sometimes I find an obscure but interesting website with information about a particular lighthouse. Maybe someone else would think that was interesting. I would have posted about a particular one I found recently, but I am using it first for my extra in the postcard exchange. In the government websites like HABS there are some great old pictures and drawings, but you find them accidentally because they are often mislabeled. Occasionally some one posts about an interesting website, but if it were in a particular place, and you did a search for the lighthouse you were researching you would find the links.

Lost lighthouses - I especially like to learn about the lights that are gone. That information is particularly hard to find. Anyone else interested?

Uploading photos for dummies – I may know just about every dumb thing you can do. Would anyone else be interested?

Please have a look and tell me what you think. I work construction, so I am not thin skinned. Have at it!

Laura,...Those are all excellent ideas, many of which were part of the CF many years ago. All of what you suggest would be worth repeating or initiating for the first time. That is the type of stuff we need to keep the CF as active and interesting as possible.

Bob

As I said in our email, I like all these ideas. Hopefully some of our members will comment on these ideas and John can also review and maybe implement them.

Laura, I really like the idea about the Lost Lighthouses. I would like to learn more about them and see any pictures folks might have. And would love for HL to produce some more of the Gone by Not Forgotten series.

It's good that people are talking and want to see the CF prosper. Communication between more CF members is of the utmost importance for good things to happen.

We all are very much aware the the economy is down, but that doesn't mean we have to be down. If we put our collective minds together and become more active at the CF, participation will improve rapidly. As John Belushi stated in Animal House, "Who's with me!"

Bob

All are great ideas. As for the events, Laura is correct that as our newletter is sent out once a week, sometimes events announcements get to our subscribers at the very last minute. We are now posting events as soon as we know about them onto our Facebook page. Although we just started that, I am getting some excellent feedback from our friends and customers about it. Think it would be a great idea as a regular forum for here too!

I've been on FB for a few months now and thoroughly enjoy the experience.

Bob

I've been gone for a number of years (~5) and have just started to 'poke around' the forums again. After a few days of digesting, I'll give you some feedback.

George - Good to see you back. Maybe someone will listen to you and your ideas because I can't get any interest going. Seems like everybody is satified with status quo and doesn't want to get involved or change anything. If you notice we only have 10-15 posts a day and they are mostly the game and travel Forums.

Nice to hear from you, George!

Bob

Has it been that long, wow!. I personal don't know you George, but I do remember your many posts and of course, your username.

Welcome Back! Looking forward to reading your posts again...

For those of you that are members of the Collector's Society and receive the Legacy that HLs(Tony) puts out quarterly, there was a good article on the Collectors Forums. Tony gave good information about the Forums and what we acomplish on the Forums along with how to join. I sure hope this helps to bring in new members and maybe revive some of the older members.

George! Nice to hear from you. Can't believe it's been that long. And of course we enjoyed those puzzles you made for us too. Hope you've been keeping well.

Yo Mombo! Congrats on hitting post #7000!

Bob

Sue & George - what fun to see your current posts!

Can Derith be far behind?????

She forgot her password but may return as Pixie!!!!

SHE is back as Pixie!!

SO she's the one who is playing the PIXIE!

I just joined yesterday, and while I don't 'see' the whole thing as a picture in my mind yet, I have been able to find several things to post about and have received replies. Replies are what will encourage me right now so that I can start to understand the whole site. So far it's a wonderful site. I would not like to see it expand to things not lighthouse. I would like to learn how to post photos. I agree with above post by Larry. Rosalie posted but I don't know how yet to find her unless I respond to a post. This is a wonderful site for me so far - and I am only one day old. I am interested in reading about other peoples travels and how to get connected to lighthouse travel opportunites.

Oh yes,we are also members of USLHS and I am trying to figure out how I can take advantage of the day trip out of Santa Barbara next month. I can drive there in a day, go on the trip, and drive home the next day. I have lived on the West coast most of my life and have visited most of the lighthouses but have never been offshore to see lighthouses there.

Oh yes, so far this site is what it is to me, so as far as talking about declining membership, I don't understand that yet and to hear it talked about is scary to me, however, I appreciate reading the posts about it and can accept that declining could happen, so yes, how to capture everyone that visits is worth whatever it takes. I am also a member of Facebook and it's fine because I can keep in contact with my family and friends, but on a completely different way than this site. I lighthouse site is what I have wanted for years, so to find this is more than wonderful and so far the people who have replied to me have been wonderful. That is a lot of work to keep up with people posting and I really appreciate it.

Thanks for your input - it's nice see the perspective of our site through the eyes of a "Newbie".

I see you are also in the Phoenix area. Not many lighthouses to view here, of course.

"Declining membership" goes with the declining interest in things collectible.

Not just Harbour Lights but all the 'manufactured' limited edition collectibles from Hummels to Precious Moments to Walt Disney. The decline started about 2000.

Some attribute it to eBay, others blame the declining economy which causes one's disposable (or discretionary) income, if any, to be hoarded. Some have just run out of room to display collections of hundreds of pieces.

Our site is visited usually by 350-425 people each day with about 75 people posting during an average month.

Lighthouses themselves were once popular -- vital, in fact. We could say that the 'value' [usefulness] of lighthouses has "declined" over the past 75 years or so because other technologies replaced their functions.

But new people came along to love them for their lore and history and variety and the beautiful locations.

These newcomers helped to save lighthouses from being destroyed because they were obsolete.

Welcome and thanks again for your input.

lgthouselady - try the search function to explore, its up near the top right corner. You can search by a members name and find Rosalie's pictures of lighthouses from ALL over the world -find information about a particular lighthouse - or find the instructions for posting photos. Then there's a test pad for trying things out. If you get stuck, leave your post there and someone will help. Love to see your pictures. Hope you get to go on the Santa Barbara trip, that would be awesome.

Thanks Laura. Also thanks for explaining to me how to find other people's posts and pictures. I need to get my passport renewed so I can travel again. I didn't 'know' about lighthouses when I used to travel. I met my first lighthouse (Cape Disappointment) in WA State in Feb. 1992 when my neighbor invited me to go with her for a weekend trip to see Cape D and North Head lighthouses. I said,"lighthouses?!". She said yes there are lighthouses down there. Anyway, I said yes and we went over there, visted those two lighthouses and the Lewis and Clark Vistors Center. I fell in love with lighthouses then and there.

lgthouselady - Try this out for photos. It works if I can do it. Just follow the 3 separate steps for posting and you will be just fine.

http://www.lighthousekeepers.com/cgi-bin/forumscgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=000427

I don't get on the forums as much as I use to. The company I work for closed the branch I worked at and thankfully I still have a job, but am having to drive an hour each way. Before I would check the posts before I go to work, come home at lunch and read the posts, and agian after work. I'm not a morning person so it's all I can do to get up earlier and leave on time to get to work.
I will try to become more active agian.

Nice to hear from you, Cyndi! Stop by when you can. That's all we can ask.

Bob

Cyndi, Great to see you post on the CF again. You joined the forums right after me, so we were newbies at the same time.

I'm the opposite of you right now. No job, but a lot of time to read the CF and post. I'd take the job and not being able to post in a heartbeat for obvious reasons.

The image is not a lighthouse, but I don't have any of those online at the moment. Labs are good though! The image below is stored in the Public folder at my Dropbox account.

Dropbox is a 'cloud' service that allows you to 1) store important files somewhere other than your house and PC and 2) to share files with others (usually files too large for email) by exchanging a link to the files. As this experiment shows, you can also host pictures there for display elsewhere on the web.

Dropbox offers 2GBs of storage for free. More than that requires a subscription. www.dropbox.com

Putting your photo at Dropbox makes sharing it here a bit easier. All you have to do is right click the image in the Dropbox Public folder and select 'Copy Public Link'. Then paste that link into the message composition window on the Fora, using the 'Image' button.

You don't have to log into Dropbox from your browser. The software installs on your PC and you can do everything from the Dropbox program. Drag and drop is supported and the upload is automatic. It is just like working with folders and files on your PC, except the Dropbox folders and files are stored online.

You do have to size your image for use on the web. If you have MS Office, it has a feature/program called MS Office Picture Manager. If you right click a picture and select 'Open With', and then MS Office Picture Manager, you can resize your image in one of several ways. Selecting a percentage of the original is probably easiest because it will preserve the proportions of your picture.

Most image processing software has something similar.

Size the image, put it in your Dropbox Public folder, copy the public link, compose your post.



Good luck,

Rick

Ahhh He or She is beautiful. Looks to be a young Lab, maybe still in it's puppy stage.

I am a Dog Lover! All Dogs.... Any Dog.... Every Dog. I've never met a dog that I didn't like! And most of the time they know it.

Thanks for sharing!

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Thank you Stephanie.

That is Logan. We don't know for sure how old he is. Four or five is our best guess. He's a rescue, along with his six brothers and one sister.

We got him the afternoon that he would have been put down. He's had the ligaments in both knees surgically reconstructed and has gone from barely being able to walk to hustling around the yard chasing tennis balls.

Note I said 'chasing' tennis balls, not 'catching' tennis balls. He's a great dog, but there's a lot of room for some more smarts in that big head!

Rick

We had a chocolate lab at my isolated LORAN A station in Yakutat, AK. He just showed up at the station one day and never left. He knew what a good thing was. One of the smartest and gentlelist dogs I have ever been around. He never missed a meal or a midnight snack when the guys were up watching a movie or playing cards. If you wouldn't give him some of what you were eating, he would go over and get his metal dish, walk up to you and drop it on the tile floor to get your attention. He loved to chase moose and one time he and the CO were out walking the beach/woods and he chased a moose calf. The mama moose took action and charged our CO and treed him. Everytime mama moose and baby started to leave, "Skipper Dog" would start on the moose calf and mama moose would charge the CO again. The CO was treed for over 5 hours before Skipper Dog decided this was enough fun and decided to quit. CO's on this Coast Guard Station were referred to as "Skippers" and thus the name Skipper Dog was given to our station dog that ALWAYS slept in the Skippers room no matter who the Skipper was. Skipper Dog would visit all the Coasties everyday in their 10 rooms during the day, but, would always sleep in the Skipper's room at night. Skipper Dog was stationed on our LORAN Station for almost 16 years before he died about 2 years after I left in 1977. He was buried with full military honors in his favorite place, outside the kitchen in the back, where he used to scrounge for leftover food.

One last thing about Skipper Dog, he wouldn't drink water from a bowl. He had his own "PRIVATE COMMODE" that was his drinking fountain. Of course, that commode was off limits for use by all station Coasties. The commode stool had a sign that said "Skipper Dog's Pot" The LORAN Station was decommisioned one year after Skipper Dog passed away so there was never another dog to take his place.

We currently have our 3rd black lab. As puppies nothing is safe from disstruction. But they grow out of it and with lots of love they have become the best pets for us. Very gentle and loving with the kids. Very protective of their families. Ours always lays on the floor on my side of the bed when Bill is home but lays in the hall between the two bedroom doors when Bill is doing his 24 at the fire department. Current one is 4 years old the past two lived to be 15 years old.

You think you get rid of us but actually we are always lurking, watching, ready to pounce when needed. Sleepers ready to be awakened!

Happy Holidays, Digger! Nice to see you're still above ground (at times).

Bob

Hi Digger -- was thinking about you the other day. Hope all is well. Take care and have a great holiday season. Will always remember those early chats when I first joined this forum years ago.

Hi Digger. Good to hear from you.

Hope all is well.

Have a wonderful holiday season!!!!

The Lightkeeper
Mike

He's ALIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bob

Hi Digger and Mike! Nice to hear from you both. How is the Chancellor coming Mike?

Wow, a whole year has past since my last post. Been very busy building a new house and moving from Murphy, NC to Lynchburg, VA. Took me awhile to find the website again as it has obviously changed from my old bookmark. Anyway Keep the Lights Shining.

Glad to see you post again George! Keep them coming.

Congrats on the new home.