Just to keep you informed --- John Chidester posted and Lamar e-mailed me that there are now 50 Wackos with 8 or more getting very close to wackodom. Then there are some cruise directors and saints who would qualify. That made close to 72 projected pin buyers.

I have counted on the posted replies and there are about 20 or so who say they will definitely buy one or more pins. Now that is a great start. The business end of it is: I just ordered pins for our club. l00 cost $2.00 or more to us, depending on the complexity of the design, and this is a good price, for a pin about 1 and 1/2 inches in size. That is $200 or more for manufacturing costs. At $5.00 purchase price per pin, we would need to sell 40 pins to cover the initial price. After that, there would be a profit per pin and that money is what would go for lighthouse restoration. The option could also be to raise the price of the pins so as to have more money to donate. What are your feelings on this?

My question now is: how do we reach the other wackos so that they know about this project? Do they all log on and read the general forum but just aren't posting replies right now? Or are there separate wackos who post only on some of the other HL forums?

Being an ex-teacher, I would like to give you all an assignment, as you have been posting here far longer than I have and probably know who other wackos are. Can you find them, contact them, ask them to read these two postings on the pin, stimulate their intertest, have them post their own replies and give a commitment if they will purchase a pin?

If/when we get enough, then the project can go to the next phase, which is a design for the pin. I have e-mailed Zina at HL and asked her if she could find out if HL has chosen a specfic lighthouse for any corporate donation program for the year 2000. When I find out, then our group needs to decide if that light is the one we want for a design, or if there is a different one we would like to feature on the pin.

The next phase after that is to get a definite price from the manufacturer based on the actual design and a mock up sample from them to check for color and inscription accuracy. Then wackos need to send in money for the pin (pre-paid orders including S & H costs) before a manufacturing order is placed, to be sure there is indeed sufficient money to fund this project.

Please continue posting your thoughts and ideas, as from them a final plan will evolve. Thank you for your enthusiasm.

Barbara

Count on us for one. And we would have no problem with the price being increased.

To answer some of your inquiries IMHO, some of us wackos actually only ready the Forum a few times a week. Yes, that really is true. So maybe some of us haven't seen this. And if we were really honest, we'd have to admit that we usually only read certain portions of the Forum. Our favorites are Lighthouse Duty, The General Forum and Nothing about Anything. Don't know about the rest of us wackos who haven't responded. You've already gotten the ones we know, with one exception. We will drop them an email.

Michael and Karen

Barbara, why not put another post in the General Forum titled, "Special Announcement, please read", or words to that effect.

By the time you get the particulars sorted out I'm sure you'll get more responses and more wackos! I'd say let everyone buy one, we're all forum members and collectors, some of us just bigger talkers, lol.

Sue

I have just gotten an e-mail from Lamar,
who has graciously agreed, when the time
comes, to take over the job of receiving
orders for Wacko pins and shipping them
out. I had explained to him that by
necessity, I live North from April to
Nov; and South Jan to March, and do much
traveling in between. Orders would never
catch up to me. Thank you Lamar for your
willingness to help put this project into
action when the time comes. Now we wait
to hear about any HL 2000 donation
project being planned; and to receive
more posting replies to show a strong
enough support --- translated to enough
pins wanted to carry the manufacturing
expense. Keep those positive replies
coming in. KTF

The 50 WACKOs mentioned includes anyone who has 50 or more posts; that includes the Cruise Directors and Saints - so don't double-count them.

If this is a 'WACKO' thing - having the 'honor' of being able to purchase an annual pin, then some additional supply of pins would be needed for those who reach WACKOdom between now and the end of the year.

I presume you are envisioning an 'Annual' so that all past WACKOs and those who reach the level in 2000 would be able to buy the 2000 pin.

Since the goal is to help one lighthouse or another, how about having the WACKOs nominate and vote each year on which lighthouse should be 'endowed'?

Perhaps we could call on the resources of Harbour Lights for some design help.

Now I'm wondering if there might be a 'secondary market' for messages? Could someone who has 35 messages posted 'buy up' the 15 messages from some person who is no longer active on the Forums?

Just wondering.

Great Idea, Barbara!

I'd be willing to sell some of my posts to a budding wacko. Will there be a green book for posts? Will the prices be different for different forums. If you have 400 posts will your posts be worth less those of someone who "only" has 100? (supply and demand)

Inquiring minds want to know.

Ab in Ala-Bam

Barbara,

Had another thought when you determine cost of pins. Charge $5.00 or whatever to cover costs and say, "Additional donations to XYZ lighthouse restoration fund gratefully appreciated."

Otherwise, we may only wind up donating $10.00.

Mombo

Keep it coming -- you're sprouting some good ideas. Yes, we would need extra pins to service those who achieve wackodom throughout the year. Good point, John. I don't think this project will go into effect until after the lst of the year though, as there is much to do getting it set up. I envisioned the first pin as a millenium pin.

Good idea about asking HL if they would help on the design. Would you undertake that part of the job, John? I had envisioned a pin similar to their membership pin -- high quality work. Is that what the rest of you are thinking of also? Or are any of you thinking of those big round 3 inch diameter or so tin pins given out at events? One of you said you wanted to put an extra pin on display next to the lighthouse. The big tin one would be overpowering, I think. I can also envision the pin itself being in the shape of a lighthouse. The man who does our club pins sent me many samples and there were many different shapes -- intriguing idea maybe.

There is nothing to say that anyone can't give more money as a donation, beyond
the selling price of a pin. That would be most generous.

I would hope once this project is full grown, that we could also get an article in the Legacy, so that those who don't post might be influenced to do so in the spirit of supporting this annual lighthouse donation fund and fun. John, what % of the society membership actually has registered on the HL site; and what % does postings? I am just amazed within my own club of 80 members to only see a few familiar names from time to time on the Forum; and I am constantly telling them about it and to read specific tidbits of information that I think they would be interested in. If you all belong to a club, is there a campaign to "educate" your members about the fun and benefits and even the very existence of these forums? Food for thought.

Will be waiting for your wisdom and input on these questions, and also John's replies. KTF Barb

No way... you're just kidding, right? LOL


Will there be a minimum words per message (WPM) required to count towards the pin? Or, would we be able to take a cumulative total of the words in our posts for a given period (such as calenday year 2000) and divide by some pre-determined number to come up with an adjusted message count?

Think we might need help from statisticians to deveop such a policy, and perhaps some moderation by our forum officials.

Dave

Oh, yeah- count me in for a pin

Well at the rate I'm going I should make "WACKO" status by the reunion, when is that? 2001? I'll buy a pin. I like, in the shape of a lighthouse...maybe the one we are donating to?

Count me in of course for one, Barbara.

Alan,
Those of us who have one of the "original 17" posts to the Forum when it first started are really going to get a premium price if we decide to sell one of them. LOL

I put a new posting on related to the
pins and lighthouse donations. Please
read "Let's Make a List -- Who Needs it
Most?" I am asking for YOUR list of
lighthouses you think could use our help.
Please read that posting for guidelines.
It's good to see that this idea is
gaining support, as more Hl'ers read
about it. We still need more Wackos and
almost Wackos to commit to buying a pin
though, so that the base manufacturing
price is covered. Keep spreading the
word as you are on other forums, and ask
them to tune into these 3 wacko postings.
Thanks a lot. KTF Barbara

I just sat down to make a tally to see how the pin order is coming along. Wackos have unofficially "ordered" 26 pins, and that includes some who wanted two. A few Wackos said "great idea" but didn't really say if they were going to order one -- please check your reply and be more specific, if this is you. And 2 close-to-wacko status wanted a pin; and two didn't say specifically. That is a total of 28 pins. We need about 40 just to meet expenses if they sell at $5.00 each. So we need to hear from quite a few more wackos and close-to-being wackos.

John, is there a master e-mail list for all wackos that I could send a message out to?

Great Idea! Great Idea!

Put me down for two. (What's the limit?)

Barbara:

I'd buy one pin for $5.00, but I'd like to see this idea blossom into a collection of sorts.

What are your thoughts on making the pin a cloisonne one, similar to Harbour Lights' annual "Redemption Piece" pin, and then make it "lighthouse specific". The specific lighthouse would be the one you donate the excess funds to.

The following year, repeat the above but choose a different needy lighthouse.

This accomplishes several things. The Wackos have a recognition pin, the lighthouse benefits from the donation, and now we can build a collection of these pins.

Who knows? This might be such a fruitful idea that we have to enlist John as the Webmaster of the Wacko Needy Lighthouse Pin Collectors' Society's Web site!

------------------
Bob Steinbrunn
Nautical Research Guild


[This message has been edited by Bob Steinbrunn (edited 09-18-99).]

Bob: You have posted a good summary of what has been evolving with each member's posted reply and suggestions on both of my original posts. I am waiting for a call back from our club member who manufactures pins to see about one in a lighthouse shape. John C. has suggested HL might do the artwork for us, and if so I am sure they would be capable of designing it to look like the specific one we vote on to become "adopted Wacko lighthouse of the year". The next step is to get that list of your 10 recommended lighthouse candidates (see my new posting on "make a list -which ones need it most") And yes, it would be great, and oh what collectibility, to have a different pin for each year, as long as enough order them to clear expenses and have enough left for a donation each year, to make it worthwhile. I hear whispers of members buying up extras to hold and sell at secondary prices later, to newly arrived Wackos who want the whole previous set. Not a bad idea, as it would put more money into the pot for the donations.

I have just spent the last hour going through forum postings, one by one, and personally e-mailing any who are designated a wacko. Very time consuming, but there are those out there who don't know about this project yet. That is how I contacted you. If all of you would do similar, it would be a big help. The pin count just rose by 2 from my e-mails. Up to 30; let's keeping it rising. THanks and Keep the Flame. Barbara

I posted on your Calling All Wackos - so don't confuse us and add 2 more to your list. I would buy 2 this year, but would probably just buy 1 per year. I'd probably be the one who might wear this pin. I feel that it should be a nice cloissone (spelling wrong?)pin. I can't offer much info regarding lighthouse restoration since we don't really live near one, but many need help. Thanks again for all the emails, Barbara, to keep us informed. As I said in my other posting, I haven't been able to keep in touch with the Forum for the last month. Hope to get back into it again this week.

Kathy

Hi Barbara,

I can tell I need to post more than just read to reach "wacko status" this year. I would like to be included in on the first issuing of the wacko pin. I promise to post more in the next few months to get to wacko.

I like the idea of the first pin being in a lighthouse shape.

Boy Barbara, you're just like having a second wife. I hide and you come find me in the e-mail (LOL).

Please count me in for one of the WACKO pins. I think it's a great idea.

Rich

------------------

Thanks, John. Your sign-off above made me have to do some research to find out what it meant. Now I know where to find the abbreviation chart. Rich, you can blame me "finding" you because of that cute little eyeglass symbol. Took me awhile before I discovered what it was for. Sure is handy.

All in good humor, Barbara - we kid the ones we love! You are a human dynamo!

Here's a couple of examples of lighthouse shaped pins from the Site to Save Sand Island (AL). Scroll down and be patient while the pictures load.

http://members.aol.com/bayoucamp/shirt.htm

Those of you who were at the Sapelo Island mini reunion might remember that Diane and I were wearing Sand Island T-Shirts. We also had the pins which are very well done. They look really neat on a hat. While waiting for the wacko pins, you might want to order a couple of the Sand Island pins. Its for a very good cause.

AB in Alabama

Barbara,

Put me down for two. Two more for the kids is a possibility. In your e-mails, don't forget the Saints & the Cruise Directors... most if not all of these are Wacko incognito

------------------
-Art

As I mentioned in a previous reply, I would be happy to buy two pins per year. I would also like to make the following suggestion regrading the cost.

Once the cost of manufaturing the pin and the cost of shipping and handling is figured out. I think that the cost of the pin should be increased by at least ten dollars for each pin. This would enable the group, known as WACKO's would be able to donate at least $1000. to a Restoration Fund. This amount is based on the sale of 100 pins. Hopefully we can double or triple that amount.

If any of you check me out you'lll find that I am not even near WACKO status, but youcan be sure that by the Millennium, I'll be there. (Added one more towards that goal by this reply).

Bert

[This message has been edited by MtnHkr (edited 09-21-99).]

Count me in!

For those who may want more than one pin, like Art above who may want 4, $10 each extra seems a bit much. I think extra contributions should be at the descretion of the donor.

Mombo

Maybe we can each buy an extra and have it sent to Mombo to use on her Wacko map in place of push pins and thumb tacks.

The final price has not been decided yet. That will depend on the final manufacturer's price which he cannot give me until he sees the final artwork design. There is a necessary progression of steps here, especially this being a first time project. It has been suggested that the price be raised to at least $10 per pin, in order to have a worthwhile donation amount after pin costs. Originally it was limited to one pin per wacko only. In other words, you have to earn the right to buy the pin by having achieved your 50 postings of wackodom. I can understand a person wishing to buy two, one to wear and one to put on display or next to a lighthouse. But wackos will not be able to buy more than that. We don't want to have this turn into a secondary market issue, which would take the meaning and prestige away from only you owning these pins. Anyone will be encouraged to give as much extra money as they wish for a donation to the selected lighthouse.

Lamar will be starting now to make a tally of the lighthouses which have been listed on the post. Then he will research which ones have an active restoration group organized and trying to raise funds, and hopefully certified as a non-profit group to legally accept donations without taxation. Lamar has also offered to post photos of these lights. When he has done his tally, we will take the top 5 or 6 which were listed multiple times, fall within the criteria above, and are hopefully not one which is already funded heavily but one which more desperately needs our help. There will then be a vote with each wacko voting for one lighthouse from that group. The lighthouse which receives the most votes will be the "winner" for the 2000 pin project.

From there, a professionally created design of the lighthouse needs to be made; and John Chidester is working on that part of the project. As these steps progress, I will keep you informed. I thank you so much for your enthusiasm and generosity for a good cause and your willingness to help on the various facets of this project. THe second year's pin won't be so hard to get organized.

Can I ask you to help me by looking in your yellow pages under manufacturerers of envelopes. We need to get a good price right from the maker for some small envelopes with bubble wrap attached inside for mailing the pins to you safely. I need a phone, address, and even company e-mail so I can contact them. If it is a company in your local area, you could also call for me and see if they would give us a discount price -- explain the charity project as such. They might even donate the envelopes and take a tax write off.

Thanks, Ladylightkeeper Barbara

To the "Ladylightkeeper",

Thanks to you for your idea and efforts. I stated in an earlier post I would like one pin, I would now like to order my two pins.

All that aside in my neck of the woods here are a few manufacturers of envelopes:

Commercial Envelope Mfg Co. Inc.
900 Grand Avenue
Deer Park, N.Y. 11729
516-242-2500

Rex Envelope Co.
76 9th Ave.
Manhasset, N.Y 11030
212-675-9200
212-633-1231 Fax

Precison Envelope & Printing Co.
170 Central Avenue
Farmingville, N.Y. 11738
516-694-3990

Keep this up and you'll be working on a Saint or Cruise Director pin instead. Put me down for one.

OK here is one more post, getting me closer to that aspireing goal...

ladylightkeeper, you refered to a abbreviation chart?? where would this be located? half the time I do not understand all of what is said on these fourms, I think that might help if it is online where I could get a peek at it. Thanks.

Also put me down for 2 pins.

I'd like a pin-everyone knows I'm wacko, but I'd like a pin to make it official!

I asked the same question about what did the abbreviations mean. Dave H nicely posted a reply on 9/19 and 20, 1999 . Look at the Forums: Collector Forums section. Then look for the post titled "Name of Ladylightkeeper's Group and scroll to the 9/19 date. He has a selection of click-ons which will lead you back to their original forum discussion on this topic with original postings by J.Timothy A. on 10/25/98; and John Chidester on 3/14/99.

Some abbreviations are for real and others are tongue in cheek. Fun reading.

This chart of real abbreviations should be posted as a permanent fixture at the very beginning of the Collector Forum, so that continually joining newbies would always have a reference chart. Can it be done, guys?

Keep up the posting and you will soon be a wacko.

I'll take two pins.

Barbara, Wackos, and Newbies,

I doubt if anyone has noticed but I haven't been in the forums for several weeks. I haven't read all the different threads and postings on this subject, but as usual, I already have some opinions.

1. The purpose of this is to collect money for lighthouse preservation. Right?

2. Cloisonne pins are very nice, but expensive.

3. Pin-on buttons can be made for well under $1 each.

4. Are we going into the LE collectibles business or trying to save a lighthouse.

5. Incidently the 1991 handout pin-on button handed out freely by HL during their first year of expositons and shows, One sold on eBay for $104.50.

6. Cheaper button. More money to charity, bigger deduction on income tax return.

Either way, I'm good for two.

The Ancient Mariner
Maybe later, John.


[This message has been edited by FredKuhl (edited 10-02-99).]

Good idea, Fred. Would be fine by me. Maybe we could auction off a few as well to raise even more money.

Mombo