Speaking as a collector and not being privy to any marketing strategy from Harbour Lights...

Let me first say that the upcoming 'Minis' are NOT part of the Harbour Lights collection. One of the reasons for this was so that avid Harbour Lights collectors won't feel obligated to buy any or every one of them. [OK, that much marketing strategy I know; and it came partly from these Collector Forums from collectors who felt squeezed by 'too many new issues']

The minis will be marketed as "This Little Light of Mine". OK, "This Little Light of Mine by Harbour Lights."

OK, it walks and talks...it must be...

I think the discussion of the "Little Lights" is fair game here because they are coming from Younger & Associates and because you all love collectible lighthouses (or you wouldn't be reading this.)

Expect 24 "Little Lights" to be available in mid-January. I believe all of these 24 are lighthouses that have already been Harbour Lights Limited Editions; but future "Little Lights" will include lighthouses not yet produced as Harbour Lights limited editions.

I think the target market for "Little Lights" is clearly gift and souvenier stores -- including lighthouse operated gift stores -- as well as 'collectors on a budget'. The size will be similar to the 3 HL miniatures issued so far (New Point Loma, Rose Island, and Point Fermin), but the detail won't be as fine as on these three. A 'Reliable Source' has said HL may still produce a "Harbour Lights" Miniature such as for Reunions or Anniversaries, etc.

Originally the prices were expected to be under $20 -- starting at $12.95. They will NOT be numbered and are open editions. Given Harbour Lights history, there is always a chance that a particular piece might be 'laid off' (unavailable for a while), 'retired' (never available again), or 'revised' (a new mold version). No PLANS to do that I know of, but all options are open.

For stores, it will be like 'popcorn' - I expect many multiple piece purchases and not just from Harbour Lights WACKOs.

What impact will the "Little Lights" have on Limited Editions? Short term: maybe a bit less demand among the 'locals' and 'souvenier' shoppers. But really if you were willing to spend $75 for one to put on the mantel as a remembrance of your vacation or childhood, would a $15 version suffice? I'd say the net will be more mini sales to people who saw $75 as way too much; for them, a $15 purchase as almost a no-brainer.

No doubt there will be people who buy or receive a "Little Light" and then investigate further and discover Harbour Lights Limited Editions and catch the fever. (I think Bill said they were going to use the same 'magic dust' on the minis that they put on the limiteds - the transdermal stuff that makes you want to buy it if you pick it up.)

What effect might "Little Lights" have on GLOW sales? Well that may be a different situation. Sure it's a $55 vs. $15 purchase decision. But for those Limited Collectors who discovered Harbour Lights too late to buy Montauk or St. Augustine or Holland, let alone Coquille, the GLOWs offer a nice option. GLOWs have had a second purpose - to allow tourists and locals to buy a sculpture of a lighthouse that would not have otherwise been available. Perhaps some will opt for a $15 over a $55 and that might cut into GLOW sales a bit; but again those prices aren't in the same ballpark. There are some GLOW only dealers, but the majority of Harbour Lights dealers carry both Limiteds and GLOWs. I don't expect that the "Little Light" dealers will be able to carry the GLOWs under the same agreement.

Harbour Lights dealers are being given the opportunity to carry "Little Lights", but other types of stores, are also being signed up.

As already suggested in other threads on this topic, "Little Lights" will make great gifts for avid collectors to give to friends. (This includes those who have admired your collection, kids who climbed the tower with you, or friends who've put up with all your 'lighthouse stories' or even trekked through uncounted stores on multi-state 'dealer road ralleye'].

[Another idea: 'placeholders' for your limiteds out on loan or in the vault. "Limited Edition SE Block #103 on Loan to the Mariners Museum through 2001." (You'll have to make up your own tent cards to display next to the mini].

Perhaps with fewer signing events in 2000, heck, Bill might even give them out to kids as he once did with the Thumbnails. (Just kidding, Bill.)

You don't HAVE to buy any or all of them; you can postpone a decision to buy any or all of them long into the future. You can even dream of selling your Harbour Lights collection when retirement approaches, replacing them with "Little Lights" and moving to a small bungalow or single-wide with small curios in Arizona or Florida.

There's more information from a 10-10 thread that just dropped off the 'Last 30 day' limit:

216.46.163.97/forums/Forum1/HTML/000523.html

Here's a repeat of Paul's photo of the four that had a sneak showing at Rosemont 1999:



[This message has been edited by JChidester (edited 11-19-99).]

What is a Harbour Light?

Yesterday: A line of large, expensive, highly-detailed, limited-edition collectibles that retired on a regular basis and were much sought-after because of their perceived scarcity.

Today: A line of large, medium, small, expensive, cheap, highly-detailed, not-so-detailed, limited-edition, open-edition, numbered, un-numbered, collectibles/giftware with no perceived scarcity that may or may not be retired/resculpted/rested.

Good grief.

Call me an old fart, but I long for the good old days when the company was focused and Harbour Lights flew off the shelves because they were not only beautiful but *limited.* Now you'll be able to get whatever wherever whenever.

I never thought they'd stoop to the level of Scaasis or Spoontiques. But if Harbour Lights puts 'em out of business, that's fine by me.

[This message has been edited by Bill Harnsberger (edited 11-19-99).]

You're an old fart, Bill.

[Boy I feel much better now that you invited that.]

Times change. Companies that don't build on their success won't be successful long.

You like the beautifully detailed large limited editions, they are still there. Even more detailed and the edition sizes are dropping.

Perhaps the line you 'liked' will be the 'classics' of tomorrow. The '53 Corvettes, the '49 Studebakers, the '57 Chevies of collectible lighthouses.

The fact that the Chevrolet line today includes so many different models and sizes doesn't detract from the desireability of a 1999 Corvette or a 1999 Suburban to certain demographic groups.

You're an old fart, Bill!!

Boy you are right John; I do feel better thanks Bill for requesting that.

I was told just this week that the expansion into the "giftware line" was in part to underwrite the increasing costs of producing the Limited Edition Harbour Lights. Harbour Lights wants to continue to make and improve the limited line and the Little Lights will actually help them do it, and hopefully keep the costs of the limited edition retail price from going up if possible. I was told that the Limited Edition Harbour Lights have always been the most important thing that Harbour Lights produces, it is still the most important thing they produce and it will always be the main focus of Harbour Lights and the Younger family.

By the way, Bill please let me know, when you want me to call you something else!

Saint WackoPaul '
Keep the Flame

Gee Bill, I long for the good old days too...the days (way back in 91-92) when you could walk into a store and pick up a CH1 and a Coquille for $50.00 each.
Jim
Johnson

Yes Bill, you're an old fart! Seemingly senile, too.



LE's live! If they're partially underwitten by other product lines, it's OK with me.

If I were on vacation in Key West or Montauk Point and my purchasing options for souvenirs to bring back home was a mug for $10.99 or a nicely made replica of the lighthouse, I'd pick the lighthouse.

If the mini affords HL's the opportunity to keep improving the LE and keep them within a reasonable price range, I'm all for it. Plus, I have a collection of lighthouses at work; now I can replace these inexpensive HL wanna-bes, with the mini line.

I see this line as being marketed towards tourists and casual collectors. I wonder if those who will become new mini-line collectors will want to be called Wackitos?

I saw the minis and I was impressed. For $12.99 you can't beat it. I'm hoping I will receive them as presents. I don't need another pair of earrings or scarf, instead I will tell my family to get me a mini (at half the price of the earrings).

Joanne

I'm glad Harbour Lights has named their latest product so it won't conflict with the name of their original products. We should be thankful they did. That will relieve some of us of the obligation to purchase everything they make.

I hope their new line is a tremendous success. I would like it to be so successful that the income generated from them would allow Harbour Lights to reduce the sizes of the LEs, maybe down to 7,500 pieces or less. This would fire up the LE market and make them sell faster, which in turn would cause a greater demand. Wouldn't it be great if HL decided to eliminate the Glows and retire them all. Now lets think about this...Glows are numbered....they stop making them....then what do you have? An Open Edition that just became very limited. Maybe the Glows would get a little more respect that way.

Bob

I'm not worried about a negative impact to either the LEs or the GLOWS. They ar still for the same audiance they always have been. I would however consider selling any Lefton stock I might have. Those are the people that hould be worried. Until now, they had a monopoly on the mini's. Now for only a few dollars more, you can get a higher quality gift or souvenier. This may be a good thing.

and you are an old fart, Bill (Hey! You told us to do it!!!)

I think John hit the nail on the head when he used the words "demographic groups". If I want a diamond and can only afford a 1/4 carat then that's what I get. But maybe the looks of the 1 carat will get me save for the future to obtain it. I don't see that people who desire and can afford a 1 carat diamond will now buy a 1/4 carat because it's cheaper. All that is not to say I wouldn't buy a mini if it was of a particular favorite light and the detail was excellant. It just wouldn't be my collecting focus. I just don't see them affecting LEs or probably GLOWs either as their prices are considerably more than $12.95.


------------------
Ken T

Bill, you're an old fart! (I'll bet you wish you hadn't left yourself open for that )

Call them what you may, they still are Harbour Lights. And I will have a difficult time deciding which to buy. It would be easier on the budget to get just the Little Light of Mine, but the LE's have investment valeue as well as just plain beauty. I'll probably end up with some of each. As a newbie I will never be able to afford a complete set of LE's anyway. I think John is right on with the demographic groups. We'll all buy what we can afford or what grabs us and Younger and Associates will make what sells. It could mean lower edition sizes for the LE's. Which I think is great. But it may not. We'll just have to wait and see.

Dale

I ask, did they? Look what John wrote!!!


This statement suggests that they are being packaged in little blue boxes with Portland Head on it. Are they? Will they have the Harbour Lights Label and not "This Little Light of Mine Produced by Younger and Associates"??

I'm confused, this is the next thing John had written



John, unless I am loosing it, these two statements contradict each other. If these are released as HARBOUR LIGHTS in HARBOUR LIGHTS boxes, Its a Harbour Light no matter what Younger and Associates want to call them. I know you didn't mention how they were packaged. I read a little between the lines because you called them Harbour Lights.

Bill I like what you have to say about the Harbour Lights Line getting too muddled up. I think its because the company is so connected to all its collectors they are working overtime to please us all.




[This message has been edited by SThompson (edited 11-21-99).]

Hey Bill, you old fart! I agree with you in respect to the fact that I miss the old days of just LE's and GLOW's.

While I think I can resist the urge to collect the "Little Light" pieces, who's to say that I won't pick one up here or there. I do hope they do well for Younger & Associates. If they do well, I think it is safe to say everyone will benefit in some way.

Besides, as of today, I only need 6 more pieces to fill in all the holes of my LE's. After that, I'll need something to spend my "extra" money on. LOL!

-Todd

How could my statement suggest how they would be packed? Or suggest what picture might appear on the box?

The identification label on the product is "This Little Light of Mine by Harbour Lights".

A Reliable Source has said the Little Lights will be packaged in small glossy solid dark blue boxes. No foam inserts. Probably wrapped in bubble wrap sheets. No certificates, no history - although the photo of the lighthouse model inside will reportedly be affixed as a label on the outside of the box.

A mini-brochure of available "Little Lights" will be packed in the box.

Does naming them "This Little Light of Mine by Harbour Lights" make them part of the "Harbour Lights Collection" despite denials of Younger & Associates?

Would naming them "This Little Light of Mine by Younger & Associates" then make them "not part of the Harbour Lights collection" or would some say it's not the name, it's the source. So they [but not I] conclude "If it's a lighthouse and if Younger & Associates then it must be collectible."



[This message has been edited by JChidester (edited 11-20-99).]

So then what your saying is that these are being produced by Harbour Lights but they are not part of the Harbour Light Collection? Can anybody else see my confusion or is it just me. A Lawyer had to think this one up. Its a Lighthouse being made by a Pseudo Company under the Pseudo Companies name but it is not part of the Pseudo Companies Collectible Line and the Pseudo Companies Parent company says its not going to be a Pseudo Company product. My head hurts, I hope that made sense.


It does in my book. How would it not? It adds more credence to what Bill Harnsberger is getting at. We have LEs, GLOWs, Society Pieces, Member's Gift's, Ornaments, Spyglass, Thumbnails, Christmas Lighthouses, and now LLOM's. If they're being labeled as Harbour Lights they're as much a Harbour Light as an Ornament, Thumbnail or Spyglass. At least with "Days Gone By" the label says "Distributed By Harbour Lights". If the label says Harbour Lights its a Harbour Light, don't promote it any other way. Just promote it as a true non-numbered Open Edition Giftware Lighthouse produced by Harbour Lights.



Thats an easy one. How many Harbour Light's products can you name that are not packaged in this type of Box? LEs, GLOWs, Ornaments, are in this box. Society and Members Gifts are not. They are in the Dark Blue Boxes.

As usual John, I am not trying to shoot the messenger. I am just trying to understand how something that says Harbour Lights on it is not a Harbour Light or part of the Harbour Light Collection?

Tim, Paul, I bet you guys are just sitting there laughing, aren't you!


"A befuddled, bewildered, non-bedazzled, Beaver"


[This message has been edited by SThompson (edited 11-20-99).]

Let the "MINI WARS" begin.


"TheLightkeeper"

Are 'Little Lights of Mine' collectible?

Are Pez dispensers collectible? Are Scassis Lighthouses collectible?* Are Wheaties boxes collectible? Are Barbie dolls collectible? Sure, if someone wants to collect some or all of the available issues of each of these items (including LLOM), they are by default 'collectible'. So are old newspapers, pennies, beer cans, etc.

Are thumbnails collectible? Yes. Are they part of the "Harbour Lights Line". Well now we'd need to pick some nits here. Would you need to have one of each to have a 'complete' collection of Harbour Lights?

They were never for sale; but they do have a product number. But the 1998 Reunion Badge has a product number. Is it part of the "Harbour Lights Collection". Not intended to be so.

The point of my post was to emphasize that Younger & Associates did not introduce "Little Lights of Mine" as a way to pull more $$$ from the pockets of Harbour Lights collectors. I am quite certain that that was NOT the idea; in fact, they have gone out of their way to make the point that you don't need these LLOM to have a 'complete collection' or even a specialty (regional) collection of Harbour Lights.

Will I 'collect' these? Yes. Will Sean? Looks like it. Will Paul? Of course. Will everyone who has all or almost all of the Limited Editions collect them? No. Will the collections of those who choose NOT to buy any or all LLOM have their 'collections' somehow become less of a 'collection' because they choose not to collect LLOM? Absolutely not.

And let's agree we're talking semantics here. When Younger & Associates says "Not part of the Harbour Lights collection" they are not denying the product line stems from the same resources as, say the Original #102 Cape Hatteras or the limited Horton Point, or the GLOW Holland Harbor. They are drawing the line between what those who bought the limited editions bought and what are clearly NOT the same thing.


* Yea, I've got 22 Scassis in a box in the garage. I bought them before I discovered HL. There's no market for them. They are still a 'collection' I haul one out every once in a while to show someone how much better HLs are.

Thanks John, The Fog is just a bit clearer. To me HL can say what they want about the collectibility of their products, the manufacturer doesn't determine how collectors will perceive the release of this new line. Like they say, "If it smells like a rose....." I think in this case we are debating a Tea Rose versus a Big American Beauty Rose. Something else we are touching on here is a good point Tim brought out a couple years ago. The Harbour Light Collection is a forced collectible meaning that the manufacturer has created this line with a limited edition number and a limited amount of them made, thereby default making them collectible. Harbour Lights has not yet stood the test of time to see how collectible and valuable they might actually be years to come. Imho, I think it's a no brainer. Harbour Lights should do very well in the Nautical Collectibles Market years down the road. Will the Wackos just fade away. Certainly not, and they will still be there looking through the Antigue Malls of the future looking for that Original Hatteras, Coquille River and maybe a complete mint set of the Panama Canal.

imho



[This message has been edited by SThompson (edited 11-21-99).]

Naw, I'm not laughing - I'm actually enjoying the discussion very much. And Sean, I think you have an excellent point. It is confusing.

However, in fulfillment of my charter as the forum's curmudgeon, and since the General Forum is a place to post when you don't know where else to post, and since I don't want to further deflect all the joy and happiness over the LLOM line, I'm taking my comments to the FSB, where I believe Mark is set to serve Brandy Old Fashions and little sandwiches with the crusts cut off.

Hope to see you there.

Rgds,
__
/im (its finally starting to feel like November)

Hmmm, I thought I already was in the FSB!

The only comment I have to add is that I don't think these should be made as "Little Lights by Harbour Lights (or whoever)" unless they have already been made as LE's.

Just suppose one of those lights you've been wishing for so fervently in the above forum were to come out as a $12.99, not too detailed mini. How would that make you feel?

For further coverage please tune to The Fog Signal Building Broadcasting Company.
Check your local listings for "This Little Lighted Goldmine"

"TheLightkeeper"



[This message has been edited by TheLightkeeper (edited 11-21-99).]

What a lively discussion...I have enjoyed reading every word...Bill, one of my grandtwins would tell you "Own Fault" for asking your status in this situation........

John, I follow your explanation. Like Joanne, I will probably get some for the office, but not my collection. For sure the LLOM will be a better product than those you have in the garage. After discovering HL I could not get over the difference in the two products.

I will never have all the LEs as I am a Regional collector. I hope HL does well in this endeavor.
Derith

For those of you interested, the following 24 will be the initial release:

St. Augustine
Old Mackinac Point
Alcatraz
New London Ledge
Key West
Nauset
Split Rock
Tybee
Pt. Arena
Cape Hatteras
Sandy Hook
Heceta Head
Cape Neddick
Cape Lookout
Holland
Boston Harbor
Barnegat
S.E. Block
Hilton Head
Bolivar
Chicago Harbor
Portland Head
St. Simmons and finally
Pensacola

-Todd

What??? Only FOUR Great Lakes lights??? But they're so cool!!!

Just had to...

Jakers

Six from the New England coast should make a few retail dealers smile. Thanks for sharing that info with us, Todd!

Bob

I saw a picture of the 24 and I've got to tell you, they look great. They look just like the LE's, but much smaller. It said each box comes with a gift card.

Joanne


[This message has been edited by Joanne (edited 11-30-99).]

The Bronze Lady @ ORLANDO has the mini lighthouses displayed on their web site with prices.

www.bronzelady.com/Harbor%20Lts/LittleLight.htm

posting this makes me a wacko.




[This message has been edited by Daniel (edited 11-30-99).]

And none from New York! Can't believe Selkirk wasn't selected, lol!

Rumor has it they're saving Selkirk for their new line of signature yard models - to be called Bill's Bug Lights. These special edtions will be 'bout the size of a volkswagen.

Daniel,
Congratulations on achieving Wackodom. And just in time for Christmas! Better go out and buy a ne HL in honorof the achievement!

Dave

Once again, the Bronze Lady beats Harbour Lights at showing people their new product. Surely they could have sent John their publicity photos earlier. Oh well...

On a purely creative level---in other words, eye appeal---TLLOM is beautiful. Very similar to the limited editions, and in some cases (i.e. Sandy Hook) even better. I think Scaasis and Spoontiques have been put on notice: Their sloppy junk is no longer acceptable.

Harbour Lights sends dealers the Lighthouse Legacy by First Class mail a few days before it is sent by Bulk Rate to Society Members. I usually get the information at the same time as the dealers, but hold it until the newsletter has been mailed to members, per Harbour Lights' instructions. I don't think dealers are given any restrictions about releasing information from the newsletter.

The Little Light of Mine catalog page that is posted at Bronze Lady's website is intended only for dealers and is NOT included with the Society Members' Lighthouse Legacy. The Legacy does include a story about TLLOM with photos of Portland Head, Cape Hatteras, and New London Ledge.




To view a larger image:

www.HarbourLights.com/catalog/LittleLights/TLLOM.jpg


[This message has been edited by JChidester (edited 12-01-99).]

Off the subject a little but seeing that Scaasis was mentioned up a couple posts...I was shopping today and saw their Charlotte-Genesee. Egad, the proportions of the house were so far off, it was terrible.

(I'll just leave now...)

[This message has been edited by mombo (edited 12-01-99).]

Trips to the southeast coast and Great Lakes with family and friends always include lighthouses. Although others admire my HL LE's, they aren't committed (correct word choice?) collectors. They do, though, want a nice model of the lighthouses that we've visited. I always cringed when they had to settle for that Scaasis or Spoontiques misrepresentation. Now I'll be proud to steer them to Little Lights. Who knows, I just might have to pick up one or two for myself!

Thanks for that update and great picture, John. At least we know what the new product and display will look like. I think Harbour Lights may have a winner.

Bob

Looks good to me. They should be a great souvenir if sold at the corresponding lighthouse.

I have become (as many of you already are) a sucker for anything concerning lighthouses. I do try to save my money for HL (they really are the best), but sometimes I just have to get something else. I have pictures, candles, suncatchers, etc, but I have no Scassis or Spoontiques. I just don't feel that they are really very good. If I am going to spend $15-20, I am happy now that I can spend it on a quality product! In the words of some other wise person from the forum (sorry I can't remember who)- BWYL!

It just sunk in (I'm not always the brightest bulb in the socket) that Harbour Lights will produce lighthouses for this line that haven't yet been made into Limited Edition sculptures.

So now I can get a brand new Harbour Lights sculpture---never before seen---for a fraction of the cost...with virtually the same sculpting quality, only on a smaller scale...and I won't feel compelled to buy the limited edition piece when it eventually comes out. I save money. I save shelf space. I win!

I'm not sure this is what Harbour Lights wants, of course. But there it is.

Unfortunately, that little nagging backseat driver in my head is ticked off. TLLOM is nothing more than miniature GLOWs under a different name...and Harbour Lights said they'd never produce a GLOW before the limited edition version was made first.

It will be very interesting to see how this new line fares.

Since it just sank in Bill, you might want to read a couple of posts in the The Fog Signal Building... This Little Lighted Goldmine thread posted by ironically, a guy with the same name as yours. Could he be related to you?
He seems to have exactly the same dim bulb, beat me with a stick, old fart attitude on the Mini's!

Saint WackoPaul '
Keep the Flame

Bill,
They will probably sell like hotcakes. The LLOM will probably outsell the Scassis and Spoontiques hand over fist, because they are better sculpted. So what if they are made by Younger and Associates., they are not the LEs. I have no plans to buy them unless I buy one as a gift for someone. And as for making a lighthouse that has not been made as a LE, it's not very likely. HL will obviously do the most popular lighthouses first, and I believe most of those are already done. But on a personal note it would not bother me if they did. As far as I'm concerened the LLOM are not HL they are giftware, and I will treat them as such. And as for their effect on LE prices, I do not expect to see one. When it comes to a mini, they are nice, but like my Pt Fermin mini, it's not my LE Pt Fermin! I do not see how anyone could confuse the two, Now the GLOW line is another matter, but that does not belong in this thread.


------------------
Weasel58



[This message has been edited by Weasel58 (edited 12-09-99).]

Paul, I looked up the other guy who has my name. We're very much in agreement. So we're going to pool our resources, buy out the Youngers, blast the GLOWs and TLLOM to smithereens in a national TV broadcast hosted by Kathie Lee Gifford (Regis was booked), and reduce the Limited edition size to 4,000. And we couldn't have done it without you.

Weasel, your points are well-taken. At the same time, since the TLLOM sculptures are perfect replicas of the limited edition models, they have "Harbour Lights" written all over them, regardless of what the company calls it. I think it would have been nice if they had treated TLLOM a little differently...perhaps using a different creative director to give them a new look. As it is, IMO, they're just mini Harbour Lights.

Don't bet any lighthouses on them not doing it. Its a perfect way for HL to offer a model of a lighthouse that may otherwise be way down on the list and several years from production. Its also an easy way to see what demand might be for it and get the LE edition size closer to the mark. If it doesn't sell well they stop making it. Much cheaper than a risky LE.





[This message has been edited by SThompson (edited 12-09-99).]

Right Sean...

And they could make some items that would have a high local interest, but not enough national interest to warrant an LE.

The Legacy said that they would be making some that had not been done as LE's.

TLLOM can serve as a nice testing ground for future LE models. If they produce a model that sells briskly across regions, they can be reasonably assured it will do well as a limited edition. Although the effects on the limited edition line would be minimal, it's one way for the company to hit the bullseye more consistently...and even produce more "Wow™s." I wouldn't bet the farm on it, but it wouldn't be a bad barometer of a lighthouse's national popularity.

[This message has been edited by Bill Harnsberger (edited 12-10-99).]

Knock, Knock... Bill... That YOU?

Hey Bill. You better be careful, there's some guy using your name on the post above who says something "nice" about TLLOM.

Hey...even Scrooge had his good days.

I need some help here. You can rest assured I'm no marketing genuis. I fail to understand how the sales of TLLOM's can be any sort of marketing test for LE's. Isn't this kinda' like saying GEO autos are a test market for Corvettes? It seems to me the audience for the two is almost totally different.

What point am I missing?
[This message has been edited by LamarB (edited 12-10-99).]

Lamar,

I think that TLLOM might be an indicator of which lights are relatively popular, but I gotta agree with you -- extrapolation of TLLOM sales to LEs is hazardous. However, this hazardous data might be better than none at all. If a test market is what HL intends to get out of TLLOM (though I don't think that's what is driving this primarily), then only time will tell if TLLOM sales are a meaningful predictor of LE demand. I kinda doubt it though, for the same reason you state.

------------------
-Art

Comparison of TLLOM sales to one another would at least give a slight clue to a LE counterpart's popularity. If there were 5 TLLOM's made that were not LE's before, and one was skyrocketing in sales compared to the other 4, I would have to think that HL's first choice of which of the 5 to make a LE of would be much easier made.

On Lamar's comparision, I think you would have to compare apples to apples a little better. If a model#1 (ie: features, colors, style) of one GEO sells much better than model#2 (ie: features, color, style) of another GEO (TLLOM#1 compared to a TLLOM#2). Would those same popular features or results of the GEO#1 also be popular within Corvette sales, so Corvette model#1 sells consistently better than the Corvette model#2 (LE#1 compared to LE#2). I think they would a little bit. No matter the price range, a bright red car will sell better than a white car. You would have to think that HL runs the numbers, and it would have at least a medium impact on the future decisions as to which one to produce as a LE.

I Don't believe my hopes for the debate team has improved much with this one...I can blame everything on the lack of nicotine though. As a final note with the Corvette comparison, Spoontiques would have to be the GEO, TLLOM would at least be a base model Miata.
[This message has been edited by Rod Watson (edited 12-10-99).]

[This message has been edited by Rod Watson (edited 12-10-99).]

As stated previously, somewhere in these forums, HL minis will blow Spoontiques away.

If the price is right, some people will buy them no matter which lh it is, if it looks nice.

I AM IN LOVE !!!!!

After seeing the photo of the display for these Little Lights I can't wait to see them in person and blow my budget all to heck buying some of them. I want to be first in line at a dealer when they are unpacked. That is if I can find a good dealer in my area. One has just closed her store/gone out of business. Another is not sure if they are going to carry any HLs any more.

------------------
Jim

Dr. Who ?

When I was in my dealer Wednesday using my once a year 25% off coupon to buy Hudson-Athens, she asked me about TLLOM. They are a chain of 7 Hallmarks of which 3 are selling HL. 3 of them sell "other" "lessor" brands. Donna told me that she has lots of requests for lighthouses, but from people who step back when they see the price of HL's. She wanted to know how the little lights were going to stand up to brand "x", and when I explained to her that was like comparing Yugos to Porsches she was excited about the potential. They will continue the HL LE's as their primary offering, but the way I read it, she does expect to move some little lights. She feels that many will buy when priced under $30 and HL is well under that.

I don't expect to try and obtain each of the new lights, but I imagine I will own several before its over. And, I'm looking forward to being able to give a nice lighthouse as a gift. There have been times I would have liked to give a LH gift, but couldn't find a replica I thought was decent enough.

Dave

I agree with Mombo. They will blow away the competition! Also, would like to buy some for gifts, and the price range is more in a area that I could afford. Looking forward to seeing them out.

Rusty

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