I am finding that two of the "long-time" HL dealers I buy from have developed a very strong negative attitude about internet competition. Recently,I had one large HL dealer "go-off" on me for purchasing HL LE pieces at drasticly reduced prices on e-bay. His "concern" was the effect ebay had on "the integrity of the collectibile marketplace". I asked him to describe his notion of the "integrity of the collectible marketplace", but alas it sounded like a simple complaint against competition from "discount dealers and sellers". I've been on autoship with this dealer for five years and have therefore purchased every LE lighthouse. I have a low number, but so what? Over the years I've spent thousands of dollars with him and have not received a single benefit beyond the items themselves (plus the 5% sales tax). I would think that the current dealers would be a little less vocal in their judgements about "collectible traitors" given this market.

Have any of you had a similar experience with your dealers or am I just associated with a "dope".

Thank goodness I have yet to run into that problem. I've used the same dealer in Dallas for many, many years. She has always been extremely helpful and goes out of her way to make sure Harbour Lights stays on their toes.

I'm also on autoship, but I've never changed dealers, even though I moved from Dallas, TX to New Jersey in 2001. Guess maybe I'm just one of the lucky ones.

bobo

I can understand a dealer being upset with dumping on ebay, I think many of us have the same concern. What I can't believe is that a dealer would go off on a customer who automatically buys one of each. It is a great situation for the dealers having product essentially pre-sold providing instant turnover and income. I would think the dealer should throw a little something your way every once in a while as a thanks. Maybe a Little Light or the ornaments or pay your Society membership. A little "thanks for buying from me" goes a long way in keeping your business.

I think this shows something. You have consistenly bought HLs from this guy for years. He has a guarentee that he will have an easy $800 from you every year.

Normally, I think that this is the kind of thing that would give you a bit of a thank-you from the dealer. Not a rebuke.

Were the pieces you purchased more recent, or older? It's not right in any way, but if you were buying a piece he couldn't get you anyway, then why not go to eBay?

That was a pretty self-centred act of his. So, he's not getting your money. Does he expect you to pony up extra $$$ just to buy from him?

Only if this dealer is located in a mental hospital.

They are absolutely correct in their way of thinking. It's that type of competion that is the downfall of the collectible industry. If every seller refused to lower their selling price below retail, then all our pieces would never be worth lower than retail.

If you decided to sell some of your HL's, would you like to get back at least what you paid for them, or would you want a buyer telling you "I can buy it on eBay for half that?"

The dealer bitching about discount pricing on the Net is absolutely correct. He can't control people's desire to give their collections away no matter what the loss. His main concern is the integrity of the collectibles he deals with. He is not concerned with a small collector trying to save a buck, here and there, and still building their collection.

Your dealer is very wise in his way of thinking. I know exactly who he is and he is right.

Bob

And I echo Bob's thoughts 100%. This is why our secondary prices are down and this is also why dealers are going out of business. The Ebay dealers are driving them out at a fast pace. If you gave your dealer a chance to get you a piece and he couldn't then go to whatever source you have to to get the piece. If he played fair with you then you have a obligation to play fair with him. I have had the same dealer since 94 and have had chances to buy from other dealer's at a lower price and also to get a double digit number. I've turned all offers down because my dealer has been there for me 110%. Whatever I ask they are willing to do for me so that means a lot more then saving a few bucks on Ebay.

I can also see this dealers point of view however, if I was one of his customers and bought the new pieces from him on autoship and he went off on me like you said then it would be a cold day in hell before I bought another HL from him. I'm sure there are other dealers who would be more than happy to have someone buying their autoships from them.

I think the dealer may have been expressing his frustrations about how collectors devalue their own collections by trying to save money by purchasing HL's at bargain prices. Harbour Lights doesn't allow their dealers to discount HL products. They know discounting devalues the worth of their pieces. This dealer knows discounting devalues pieces. In other words, HL and this dealer think the same way. I don't think the dealer was scolding the consumer. He was just trying to change his way of thinking to the way it should be if you want your collection to hold value.

Bob

[Rant Button ON]

It happens in almost every kind of business you can think of...

You're in the newspaper business and along comes television. (Have you noticed most of the 'news' in newspapers is more in-depth and/or not really 'news,' but reports on style, home values, health issues? Can you remember when newspapers printed only black and white photos?)

You own a mom and pop book store and along comes Barnes and Noble, Borders, and (gasp!) Amazon.com. (You end up specializing in Mystery books.)

You own a television store (yes, they had those one time) and along comes Best Buy, Circuit City and even though they don't sell at much of a discount, the choices, warranties, and free-delivery from these electronic stores are attractive.

Times are changing -- and you've got to change with them. If your customers are shopping online, you've got to be able to take orders that way too.

We all complain about how 'business is changing,' these days. Business has always been changing. That's why we have electric light bulbs instead of gas lights these days.

If you're in business you have to decide whether you are selling 'buggy whips' (not much future) or something that you can continue to market and make money at selling if you adopt the latest technology and marketing ideas to your operation.

Keeping customers doesn't just mean lower prices. It can mean better service, free delivery or shipping.

The speed at which change happens is accelerating. If you're in business, keep up or get out of the way.

Complaining to your best customer isn't the way to improve your relationship. Giving them free shipping or 'rebating' the sales tax in order to hang on to a solid repeat customer who may generate $1,500 in business each year might work. Even a call thanking them for their business might help.

[Rant button 'OFF']

John,

I agree with what you are saying. However, there is always another side to the coin. I have a friend in South Dakota who opened up a blacksmith shop years ago. He's now got more business than he can handle and is now making more money than he was when he was working as a Project Manager for a large computer firm.

One never knows! He also told me that he sold over 1600 'buggy whips' last year.

bobo

I'm with you, TDSimpson, I'd never buy from that dealer again...instead of bitching at his customers, he should be bitching to HL about his fellow dealers...they're the ones dumping their stock on Ebay.

Hey everybody lets not lose sight of one aspect of this issue that has not been addressed-

It takes two to tango. Those dealers would not be able to dump their excess inventory on ebay, etc if there was not a willing populace of buyers- some in this category have chimed in on this thread.

You also have to lay some of the blame at the feet of Harbour Lights- they didn't help things by upping the edition numbers so high for so long. They have seen the light in the past few years but the damage was done to these dealers- and collectors.

Yes, the general economy and the cycle of collectibles is at fault for this also- it's not only a HL thing.

I will agree that the dealer's attitude towards a good customer who gets one of every item is a bit strange. I could understand the dealer going off on an occasional customer more, but even then the dealer is attacking the wrong end of the problem.

Of course, these are just my opinions.

Dennis

That is the point, I do believe. Don't go off on the person in the store buying from you at retail (especially one who is on autoship and you have a guaranteed sale every issue.) Go after HL for not nailing the dealers who are dumping product. We can all understand the dealer's frustration with the situation, but this sure isn't what you would think of as good customer service, or trying to keep a loyal customer.

As I said, if I were a dealer with a customer on autoship, I'd be throwing him a bonus every once in a while instead of jumping down his throat.

I got to agree with Dave and TD. If a dealer jumped down my troat, I would tell them were to get off, and then never set foot in their store again.

I also will BUY any HL at any price I want retail or LESS!!!!