This is the continuation of ladylightkeeper's post updating the status of the Wacko pin project.

For the first part of this thread click on the following:
Part One

[This message has been edited by engbrady (edited 01-31-2000).]

Wow, 50 posts in just 3 days. Just wondering, is this some kind of a record?

Wow! Talk about overload. I've been away from the forums since the 27th so I just read all 50 posts.I think it has all been said already, but here's my 2 cents- The idea was and is a great idea; yes there is an exclusiveness about it- but that comes with the territory- we are an exclusive group to begin with. This is not a bad thing, just a matter of fact. I believe that the major objection was not to the opinions expressed, but how and when. I stand by my support of this project and want to get my 2 pins whenever the hard working people behind this project can get them to me. i want to add my thanks to all involved with this project- including anyone who expressed their opinions when asked for them and helped to mold this project. I do not believe that anyone had a nefarious motive for their objections, just that they had bad timing. I plead guilty also to some "cheap " posts, but I tried to give meaningful posts most times. Sometimes that does not take much Dennis Whelan

Barbara, please ignore the naysayers. It was a good idea last year and is still a good idea. Press on with the project and please accept an order for one pin for me.

I just kinda got caught up with my forum reading - looks like the pin thing is a hot potato.

For what its worth, here is the complete text I originally sent my part of the discussion on this topic in a private E-mail which was relayed to Lamar and LadyLightkeeper



Pretty much my standard laisze-faire attitude, and I'll stick by it. Heck if someone wants to sell a pin, whether it says 'Wacko' or 'Smash the GLOW Molds Now!' then more power to 'em - thats just American capitalism at work. As for me, if I really want to contribute to lighthouse preservation, I'll write a check to a preservation society.

Having access to the full exchange, its only fair to note that the original message in Pt I of this thread is an editorialized account of what people said.

Trying to temper my words, I'll simply remark, the public posting of an exchange done in private was pretty darn tacky and in poor taste. I had no problem with JC sharing my remarks via E-mail with the pin people. However, if I write to someone via E-mail, I don't expect to see my correspondence splayed out in a public forum - whether my name is attached to it or not. It would have been very easy for any of the Saints to have held the discussion in public if thats what they wanted to do. But a private exchange of messages is exactly that - and should be respected. Paul is correct in suggesting the whole business was blown entirely out of proportion. The first msg in this thread does nothing but incite people's feelings for no apparent reason. Goodness knows theres already been a bizillion messages from people saying they want to buy a pin.

So for the sake of accuracy, here's the follow-up message I sent on 12/26 to my fellow saints after seeing the msg. JC sent to Lamar.


Not exactly boogie-men jumping out of the closet, eh?

Part of the reason for writing this is cause I'm a little ticked off, and partly because the original posting was made without sharing all the other correspondence that went on with this brou-ha-ha and thus is an incomplete representation of the facts. And some of this coulnd't have been posted because the poster wasn't privy to it, and is not aware of the complete discussion. All the more reason to keep a private discussion private. The quotes from myself above, are only my part of the exchange and include a quoted portion from another already made public.

For what its worth, in my opinion the entire conferencing among the Saints was entirely in good faith and out of a concern for the this forum and its participants - that concern solely being that someone might feel left out because they had not reached Wacko status. Whether you agree or disagree, isn't it a good thing to at least give those sort of concerns some thought? It was not, as some messages hint at, a comment on the people who wanted to do this pin thing, and I didn't perceive any of my fellow Saints as "naysayers".

Believe it or not, the folks that work these fora, Saints in particular, have nothing but the best intentions and a concern for the positive well being of the message board and for our hobby - I'm proud to call each of them my friend. Having been here from before the start, I've seen lots of different folks come and go. I'll blow off the remarks about 'animosity' and 'slamming' by figuring that whenever you get this many people together there's bound to be some misunderstandings over just about anything. You can expect agreement and you can expect disagreement. Just cause someone disagrees with you (or agrees with you) shouldn't be taken personally. Just be willing to respect other peoples right to have an opinion - and - respect other people by keeping private communications private.

Rgds,
__
/im

And to answer JeffB, I think there's been a couple posts where we hit 50 inside 24 hours.

[This message has been edited by JTimothyA (edited 02-02-2000).]

Well said Saint Tim!

I hope that Lamar and Barbara see that the wackos are behind you! In fact I think it appears that the Saints are too!

I am thankful that the saints take such interest in the forums and have concern for everyone that participates. They do a great job! Wacko is not a copywrited name. Anyone can use it for a pin, hat, shirt or what ever they want. I'm glad that Lamar and Barbara have taken the time and effort to get everyones input in the pin project.

There are many debates that occur here in these fora becaue of different ideas and beliefs, that shouldn't stop anyone from posting or doing a special project like the pin. Remember these are only opinions. Don't let other's opinions hurt your feelings. I think its great that we can have open discussions even if the timing was not the best or the topic is something that is sensative. Just keep it in good taste and keep posting your ideas!

Dale

[This message has been edited by DALE LAWRENCE (edited 02-02-2000).]

IF I reach WACKO status (I have no idea how many posts I have) count me in for 2 pins!

Haven't been on the forums for a couple of weeks because we were visiting our son in
Florida - but took a GREAT side trip to Amelia Island, St. Augustine and Ponce de Leon - BEAUTIFUL lighthouses and a thrill to visit. And found a retail store in Jacksonville (Edgewater Treasures) and just happened to see a stack of HL boxes ready for shipment - no doubt to some of you!

I thoroughly enjoy this site and reading all your posts - and special thanks to all who manage the forums.

Barbara and Lamar - Keep the Flame! You're doing a great job and your efforts are appreciated.

Also due to system crashes and just being too busy, I
too had been away from the forums for awhile.
When I read some of the post about the pin, I emailed Barbara
to please explain the project to me. She graciously got
back to me explaining all the details and where the project
had progressed to from that time. I missed out on the choosing/voting
of the lighthouse, but I couldn't be happier with the choice of Morris
Island.
I've read all the post here and it's plain that everyone is in favor
of the project going forward. Barbara, I'll take 2, please.
As to the dissension, I feel it came about out of respect for one more person's
opinon, albeit late. Lamar could easily have continued on a forward course.
Dissension from respect? Could also be called debating or a discussion of
opposing views. There have been alot of these types of discussions
in these forums. But never have I detected any disrespect amongst the
participants.
Thanks to JC and his "crew" of fellow Saints and Cruise Directors we have
a great place to come to to share in our love for HL lighthouses.
However it's up to all of us to keep these forums a place where people will WANT
to come back to time and again.

Debbie

2 cents don't buy much these days.


------------------

Tim you state the facts well. I have been giving a lot of thought to the pin thing and have had the privilege of having some private conversations with some of the folks who have gotten their feelings a bit hurt. One thing that I really would hate to see is any of our Saints (or anyone) feeling that they have to curb their thoughts regarding what goes on here. We should be very grateful that they care and work so hard at making this an enjoyable place for those of us who have a common hobby.

Michael and I are some of the old timers around here and we have watched it develop from the very beginning. I consider John Chidester a friend. He has proven that to me on a number of ocassions and he is a man of tremendous caring and integrity. I also know his concern for all of the folks here on the forum and because of that I feel very confident that his choice of Saints was extremely well thought out. I therefore, have to say that the saints are with us, they are for us and they are definitely into having fun. They have shown that many times. I have gotten to know a few of them over the years and they all have their quirks, but coming from me, that's a little funny. Ms. Quirks herself. (In my way of thinking; no quirks equals boring.) But each and every one of our Saints knows their HL stuff, they are all good men who want only the best. And I agree that what was said in private should have been kept in private. And it should have been worked through in private.

Lord knows, I have had some private conversations with some of my old friends who are also on the Forum where I would have been very disturbed if some of my comments had been made public. If they had been made public, someone might not have understood all of the complexities involved in my comments or the interaction with the other people involved in the private conversation and probably have been hurt by them. Something that none of us wants.

Rest assured that we have a really good group of folks running this Forum; all of whom have survived due to their good senses of humor.

So with that all said. We are looking forward to receiving our pin.

Karen

[This message has been edited by Michael and Karen Power (edited 02-03-2000).]

You can put me down for one pin.
I didn't make 50 posts by 12/31/99, and so assumed that I would have to pass. (I am not one generally to submit a post unless I feel I have something worthwhile to say.) While I support the idea of raising money for lighthouse preservation, I, for one, did not see it as a race to reach 50 by 12/31. (I think I was at 46 at that point.) But if my now reaching that total makes me eligible, count me in, not because I feel the pin is something I just have to have, but because of the cause being supported.
Thanks to Lamar and LadyLightkeeper for their efforts.

>>One thing that I really would hate to see is any of our Saints (or anyone) feeling that they have to curb their thoughts regarding what goes on here. <<

Not for a minute. Nonetheless - despite our regular reinvention of the meaning of the term 'wacko', even I must occasionally bite my tongue. For example - I was very tempted to sign-off my previous post with the oft heard phrase "Badges? We don't need no steenking badges." but, model of restraint that I am, I held back. (rofl!)

Rgds,
Saint Flameware

>>Maybe we all need to temper our words whether they are public or private ie. Golden Rule thing.<<

Just be civil, no cussin, and speak to the message, not about the person. That's the rules I use in the fora I moderate. Use them there little smiley thingies to inflect your meaning.

Rgds,
Saint Body Language

No prematurehair loss here, Mombo

As the pin design now stands, the name Harbour Lights does not appear.


[This message has been edited by LamarB (edited 02-03-2000).]

Thanks Barbara&Lamar!Don't forget my 2 pins.The Forum sounds like a normal family to me!

I have read over your replies many times to my original post on the problems with the pin project. I want to thank all of you, Saints, wackos, newbies, for taking the time to make your viewpoints known, whether they were in agreement or disagreement with what I said. This is what discussion is all about – putting
forth both sides of an issue. Not everyone always agrees with a view, and this is the nature of life. I would like to make it clear though, despite a few comments, that in no way was I aiming my comments towards any one person personally; nor giving a pep talk; nor speaking against Sainthood, as I fully appreciate the time and dedication these people have put in on behalf of lighthouses and making the Forum an inviting and educational site to log onto. I think that it is good that all views have been posted here, so that we know exactly how everyone feels and where this project can now head. There seems to be overwhelming agreement that the project should go on as originally structured. And this is WHY I posted, as Lamar and I really needed to know if we had full or majority support , from an economic standpoint, as we couldn’t afford money-wise to put the prototype into production and then maybe later find out that our viewpoint wasn’t being held by enough “others” --- and we would not have enough orders and be stuck with the initial production costs ourselves.

So, to summarize, the majority of you feel that this pin will not produce any real divisiveness, as it already exists in a completely FUN way because of the various name categories of Saint on down. You have agreed that we ARE exclusive, but it is all in FUN. You have stated that it is worth the time to post and become an exclusive WACKO. And you have shown your support by re-emphasizing your desire to buy your pins.
Lamar and I thank you for this support. To those who sat a bit on the other side of the fence, we hold no hard feelings and truly welcome your support --- for it is all being done to help save lighthouses; not for any personal glory on our part, as we will also welcome anyone who would like to help us for 2001.

Therefore the project will continue; and I will issue a new post to that effect. I am also going to ask Joanne to close this thread, as I think all has been said that needs to be said and we should end this thread on a happy note of “onward to help our lighthouses.”


ladylightkeeper